plum
31st July 2005, 08:19 PM
interesting (and looong) paper:
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/talmud1.htm
some quotes that caught my eye...
The following is narrated in the Tract Kallah, 1b:
"Once when the Elders were seated at the Gate, two young men passed by, one of whom had his covered, the other with his head bare. Rabbi Eliezer remarked that the one in his bare head was illegitimate, a mamzer. Rabbi Jehoschua said that he was conceived during menstruation, ben niddah. Rabbi Akibah, however, said that he was both. Whereupon the others asked Rabbi Akibah why he dared to contradict his colleagues. He answered that he could prove what he said. He went therefore to the boy's mother whom he saw sitting in the market place selling vegetables and said to her: "My daughter, if you will answer truthfully what I am going to ask you, I promise that you will be saved in the next life." She demanded that he would swear to keep his promise, and Rabbi Akibah did so - but with his lips only, for in his heart he invalidated his oath. Then he said: "Tell me, what kind of son is this of yours"? To which she replied: "The day I was married I was having menstruation, and because of this my husband left me. But an evil spirit came and slept with me and from this intercourse my son was born to me." Thus it was proved that this young man was not only illegitimate but also conceived during the menstruation of his mother. And when his questioners heard this they declared: "Great indeed was Rabbi Akibah when he corrected his Elders"! And they exclaimed: "Blessed be the Lord God of Israel who revealed his secret to Rabbi Akibah the son of Joseph"!
That the Jews understand this story to refer to Jesus and his mother, Mary, is clearly demonstrated in their book Toldath Jeschu - "The Generations of Jesus" - where the birth of our Savior is narrated in almost the same words.
This pains my heart to read.
The Talmud gives two reasons why the Goim are unclean: because they eat unclean things, and because they themselves have not been cleansed (from original sin) on Mount Sinai. In Schabbath, (145b) it says:
"Why are the Goim unclean? Because they eat abominable things and animals that crawl on their belly."
Likewise in Abhodah Zarah, 22b:
"Why are the Goim unclean? Because they were not present at Mount Sinai. For when the serpent entered into Eve he infused her with uncleanness. But the Jews were cleansed from this when they stood on Mount Sinai; the Goim, however, who were not on Mount Sinaim were not cleansed."
I've never heard of the cleaning from original sin at Sinai... Do you think this only applies to the individuals at Sinai? So... a few thousand people were cleansed from original sin? No more? Hm...
In Zohar (I, 28b) we read:
"Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field, etc. (Genes. III, 1.) 'More subtle' that is towards evil; 'than all beasts' that is, the idolatrous people of the earth. For they are the children of the ancient serpent which seduced Eve."
The best argument used by the Jews to prove that Christians are of the race of the devil is the fact that they are uncircumcized. The foreskin on non-Jews prevents them from being called the children of the Most High God. For by circumcision the name of God - "Schaddai" - is complete in the flesh of a circumcized Jew. The form of the letter "Isch" is in his nostrils, the letter "Daleth" in his (bent) arm, and ain appears in his sexual organ by circumcision. In non-circumcized gentiles, therefore, such as Christians, there are only two letters, "Isch" and "Daleth", which make the word "Sched", which means devil. They are, therefore, children of the "Sched", the devil.
Uhm, yikes? Thoughts?
Christian festivals, especially Sunday, are called Ion Ed - day of destruction, perdition, misfortune or calamity. They are also simply called Iom Notsri - Christian Days. The word Ed rightly interpreted means misfortune or calamity, as appears from the Gemarah and the Glossaries of Maimonides in Abhodah Zarah (2a):
"The word Edehem means the festivals of the Christians, since it is written (in Deuter. XXXII, 35): the day of their calamity."
Maimonides also says in Abhodah Zarah (78c):
"The words Edehem means the foolishness of their festivlas. It is the name for their despicable feast days which do not merit the name of Moedim, for they are really vain and evil."
Baretenora also writes:
"The word Edehem is the name for their ignominious festivals and solemnities."
The marginal notes of Tosephtoth also give this name to Christian festivals. Thus in Abhodah Zarah (6a):
"The Day of Evil, that is the Christian Day, is forbidden to us as well as all their other feast days."
Some Christian festivals are mentioned by name, such as the feast of Christmas and Easter. Moses Mikkozzi, referring to the above text of Abhodah Zarah , says:
"Rabbi Sammuel declares, in the name of Solomon Iarchi, that in particular the festivals of Christmas and Easter, which are their principal evil days and the foundation of their religion, are forbidden to us."
Maimonides, in hilkoth Akum (ch. IX) has the same:
"Sammuel repeats the words of Rabbi Sal. Iarchi which forbid us particularly to celebrate the feasts of Christmas and Easter, which are celebrated on account of him who was hanged."
I'm no scholar of the Talmud, and these are isolated quotes to be sure... but it is curious to see what is written down anywhere, much less the Talmud. If this man quoting these things is wrong or misquoting someone, please tell me so I can not post improperly.
http://www.biblebelievers.org.au/talmud1.htm
some quotes that caught my eye...
The following is narrated in the Tract Kallah, 1b:
"Once when the Elders were seated at the Gate, two young men passed by, one of whom had his covered, the other with his head bare. Rabbi Eliezer remarked that the one in his bare head was illegitimate, a mamzer. Rabbi Jehoschua said that he was conceived during menstruation, ben niddah. Rabbi Akibah, however, said that he was both. Whereupon the others asked Rabbi Akibah why he dared to contradict his colleagues. He answered that he could prove what he said. He went therefore to the boy's mother whom he saw sitting in the market place selling vegetables and said to her: "My daughter, if you will answer truthfully what I am going to ask you, I promise that you will be saved in the next life." She demanded that he would swear to keep his promise, and Rabbi Akibah did so - but with his lips only, for in his heart he invalidated his oath. Then he said: "Tell me, what kind of son is this of yours"? To which she replied: "The day I was married I was having menstruation, and because of this my husband left me. But an evil spirit came and slept with me and from this intercourse my son was born to me." Thus it was proved that this young man was not only illegitimate but also conceived during the menstruation of his mother. And when his questioners heard this they declared: "Great indeed was Rabbi Akibah when he corrected his Elders"! And they exclaimed: "Blessed be the Lord God of Israel who revealed his secret to Rabbi Akibah the son of Joseph"!
That the Jews understand this story to refer to Jesus and his mother, Mary, is clearly demonstrated in their book Toldath Jeschu - "The Generations of Jesus" - where the birth of our Savior is narrated in almost the same words.
This pains my heart to read.
The Talmud gives two reasons why the Goim are unclean: because they eat unclean things, and because they themselves have not been cleansed (from original sin) on Mount Sinai. In Schabbath, (145b) it says:
"Why are the Goim unclean? Because they eat abominable things and animals that crawl on their belly."
Likewise in Abhodah Zarah, 22b:
"Why are the Goim unclean? Because they were not present at Mount Sinai. For when the serpent entered into Eve he infused her with uncleanness. But the Jews were cleansed from this when they stood on Mount Sinai; the Goim, however, who were not on Mount Sinaim were not cleansed."
I've never heard of the cleaning from original sin at Sinai... Do you think this only applies to the individuals at Sinai? So... a few thousand people were cleansed from original sin? No more? Hm...
In Zohar (I, 28b) we read:
"Now the serpent was more subtle than any beast of the field, etc. (Genes. III, 1.) 'More subtle' that is towards evil; 'than all beasts' that is, the idolatrous people of the earth. For they are the children of the ancient serpent which seduced Eve."
The best argument used by the Jews to prove that Christians are of the race of the devil is the fact that they are uncircumcized. The foreskin on non-Jews prevents them from being called the children of the Most High God. For by circumcision the name of God - "Schaddai" - is complete in the flesh of a circumcized Jew. The form of the letter "Isch" is in his nostrils, the letter "Daleth" in his (bent) arm, and ain appears in his sexual organ by circumcision. In non-circumcized gentiles, therefore, such as Christians, there are only two letters, "Isch" and "Daleth", which make the word "Sched", which means devil. They are, therefore, children of the "Sched", the devil.
Uhm, yikes? Thoughts?
Christian festivals, especially Sunday, are called Ion Ed - day of destruction, perdition, misfortune or calamity. They are also simply called Iom Notsri - Christian Days. The word Ed rightly interpreted means misfortune or calamity, as appears from the Gemarah and the Glossaries of Maimonides in Abhodah Zarah (2a):
"The word Edehem means the festivals of the Christians, since it is written (in Deuter. XXXII, 35): the day of their calamity."
Maimonides also says in Abhodah Zarah (78c):
"The words Edehem means the foolishness of their festivlas. It is the name for their despicable feast days which do not merit the name of Moedim, for they are really vain and evil."
Baretenora also writes:
"The word Edehem is the name for their ignominious festivals and solemnities."
The marginal notes of Tosephtoth also give this name to Christian festivals. Thus in Abhodah Zarah (6a):
"The Day of Evil, that is the Christian Day, is forbidden to us as well as all their other feast days."
Some Christian festivals are mentioned by name, such as the feast of Christmas and Easter. Moses Mikkozzi, referring to the above text of Abhodah Zarah , says:
"Rabbi Sammuel declares, in the name of Solomon Iarchi, that in particular the festivals of Christmas and Easter, which are their principal evil days and the foundation of their religion, are forbidden to us."
Maimonides, in hilkoth Akum (ch. IX) has the same:
"Sammuel repeats the words of Rabbi Sal. Iarchi which forbid us particularly to celebrate the feasts of Christmas and Easter, which are celebrated on account of him who was hanged."
I'm no scholar of the Talmud, and these are isolated quotes to be sure... but it is curious to see what is written down anywhere, much less the Talmud. If this man quoting these things is wrong or misquoting someone, please tell me so I can not post improperly.