Family or Church matter?

[MJVLoves2Sing]

If one of the members of your church had an 18 year old daughter (of legal age) who felt she was living in an unhealthy environment at home, and had made it clear for some time to her parents and others that she would be moving out, and the parents had said they were okay with that, came to you asking you if she could stay with you for a week or two while she tries to find an apartment....would it be wrong for you to take her in?

Should the church involve itself?

What if her parents just didn't want YOU to take her in because of their pride?

What if they didn't want ANYONE at the church to take her in because it was embarrassing to them?

What if this parent was a Youth Pastor in your church who in the past caused other youth to be hurt by his dealings with them and by bad mouthing them?

What if the Pastor (who doesn't know all the family dynamics, nor wants to, nor does the daughter want to tell him in order to protect her parents reputation) asks that you not take her in, honoring the parent’s request that you don't, and you refuse, but keep it private, should you be not allowed to serve as Sunday school teacher or worship team member?

What if you disagree on this matter with the pastor, have kept this private, yet do not turn her away, should you be told to leave the church?

[e=mv^2]

You take her in.

Allowing someone's embarrasement to make you turn someone in need away is a bad thing. You take her in and give her food and shelter and whatever else she needs. You also keep your mouth shut about it.

but that is just me....

[TwinCrier]

I agree, though the specifics of this hint that this is not a hypothetical situation.

[MJVLoves2Sing]

Thank you for responding. I realize I was vague in some areas, I was hoping to keep my post short, ha.

In unhealthy I mean they are verbally and emotionally abusive. It has gone on for years, constantly berating her, calling her stupid, tramp for hanging out with guy friends, lesbian for hanging with girls, the list goes on. In the home, it is common for her mother to talk poorly about the kids in our youth group (of which I have two), calling them juvinile deliquents, loosers and that they'll never amount to anything. They have ramdomly threatened to withhold college funds when they lose their temper. I realize this is one common form of parenting as a means of control, but the consequence for this type of parenting is that your kid will move out. And I might add, this is a very nice girl, very moral with good Christian values who never had any real issues with their rules such as curfew or where she was going. They don't want her to stay with us because they are afraid that others will know that they haven't been great parents, and therefore will jeopardize his position and authority as a youth pastor. This is where his pride comes in. If she moved out without first coming to us or any other church family, it wouldn't make them look bad. But there was a recent incident where her parents gave her the my way or the highway speech and she chose the highway. In this case they wouldn't let her stay home for 2 days while her parents went to camp, and yet they will let her move out. This was one more illogical thing for her to deal with.

As far as our Pastor, I agree, he was certainly in his right to counsel and advise, but he was offended that we didn't think he had a right to demand that we comply. I think his pride got in the way too, and yes, we were asked to leave the church. But not before we had already decided it was time to go.

[e=mv^2]

As far as our Pastor, I agree, he was certainly in his right to counsel and advise, but he was offended that we didn't think he had a right to demand that we comply. I think his pride got in the way too, and yes, we were asked to leave the church. But not before we had already decided it was time to go.
No human being can ever make you leave the church. Ever. You are a child of God and noone can ever take that away. Regardless of how the situation was created you have been blessed by God with the opportunity to help someone in need. Remember that when you help someone in need you are giving that very same assistance to the living God himself.

Do not focus on how the situation came to be. Keep the communication lines open between father and child as long as there is no further abuse. You may find that this situation resolves itself quite quickly.

God bless you for helping the one in need.

[MJVLoves2Sing]

Sorry, I had to post this in two posts to get it all to fit......

The pastor is citing Hebrews 13:17 which says, "Obey your leaders and submit to their authority. They keep watch over you as men who must give an account. Obey them so that their work will be a joy, not a burden, for that would be of no advantage to you."

But I believe this was meant for them to show us our sin, and I can't see where this is a "sin". They are just embarrassed that it will make them look bad, that she couldn't stand living with them, and preferred us over them. By the way, most of the teens do, because we don't harp on their silly dress style or their lame lingo, we look in thier hearts and see what they will become, not what they are now.

And then there's this issue of them not following Matthew 18:15-17 "If your brother sins against you, go and show him his fault, just between the two of you. If he listens to you, you have won your brother over. 16 But if he will not listen, take one or two others along, so that 'every matter may be established by the testimony of two or three witnesses. 17 If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, treat him as you would a pagan or a tax collector."

He never came to us, but involved another to come to us first, a friend of mine, then went to the pastor, who came on his own with the church secretary and made his demand and conditions for fellowship. We have yet to speak to the youth pastor or his wife. The Pastor then took it to the elders, without an opportunity for them to hear our side, and confirmed his decision.

We know we could fight this, but at what cost to the church.

The sad thing is we have many friends there and have come to love our church very much. It is hard to leave when we also feel we shouldn't say why.

[HumbleMan]

First, I don't think that person should be anywhere near a youth group, let alone be a youth pastor.

Your obligation to the well being and continued Christian education of that child is more important than anyone's pride.

[Adoniram]

MJVLoves2Sing-

First of all, I agree with Humbleman. That couple, if they what to continue teaching the youth, needs to get their own house in order. Maybe they need to have pointed out to them what Paul taught in 1 Tim. 3:4-5 "4 He must manage his own family well and see that his children obey him with proper respect. 5 (If anyone does not know how to manage his own family, how can he take care of God's church?)" Now the concept of making his children obey him is not meant to mean that he rules without understanding and compassion as Paul points out in Col. 3:21- "Fathers, do not embitter your children, or they will become discouraged."

I am not sure what I would do were I in your shoes, it is tough having to leave the church you have been established in. Perhaps you should ask the girl if she would mind going with you and having a talk with the pastor (because he "doesn't know all the family dynamics"), if you accompanied her for support. I understand that she wants to protect the families' reputation, but if the pastor is any kind of a man of God at all, he should be able to listen to her problems and offer some discreet advice or at least understanding. And that might square things between you and him also. If the pastor is interested in maintaining the integrity of the church, then he has a vested interest in knowing what is going on with his associates, and it is best if he hears it first hand, i.e. from the daughter. And then, of course, it needs to be him that points out to the girls parents the things from Paul's teaching that I mentioned above.

As for your taking the girl in for a short time, I am reminded of the story of the Good Samaritan, who stopped to help a stranger in his hour of need, when none of the "so-called" religious people would.

Above all, of course, seek God's will in your prayers. Perhaps he is leading you from this church into another ministry where he has need of you.

These are just some thoughts. I pray that all works out well for you, as well as the girl.

[JMandrell]

I say take her in, but only with the parents approval. With her being 18 there could be some serious legal issues that might be brought up.

Has anyone sat down and talked with the parents about what they are doing to their child? I can't imagine a mother and a father that would want to create an atmasphere that pushes their children away. Maybe their lifestyle has become a habit? Maybe they don't realize their childs point of view? I think the important thing is that everything should be done to help all parties realize how important it is to comprimise and make the family thing work.

Of course, I'm not there. So I don't see everything going on. I will pray for them.

[colinlindsay]

Thanks for sharing all this.

This is the reality of the church.

I have had similar issues. I can't give an opinion because it's SO easy from the outside from these message boards.

< < the Pastor (who doesn't know all the family dynamics, nor wants to > >

This is what interests me because it's my opinion that generally the pastor or the leader finds pastoral issues a pain, and a distraction from preaching and managing growth and outreach.

My problem is that after 20 years of pastoring maybe they are right.

And yet again, what about I Corinthians 13.

My instinct in this case is to go with the pastor, that's what he's paid for and cease to worry about it. But if you're a caring person, it's difficult to do that, isn't it? Been there, myself. The peace of God for you is what you need and that's what I'll pray for.

I presume these parents are Christians?

[kidsminister]

[QUOTE=JMandrell]I say take her in, but only with the parents approval. With her being 18 there could be some serious legal issues that might be brought up.

QUOTE]

At age 18, a person is a legal adult and can live wherever and with whomever he or she wishes.

I would question why this youth pastor is being kept on staff if he and his wife are making derogatory comments about teenagers - whether or not they mean to be making those comments about just their daughter (which is bad enough!), they are implicating her friends in their attacks. A good youth pastor considers all of the kids in their town to be potentially part of their ministry, whether or not they attend their church regularly.

My advice is, "We must obey God rather than man." What do you feel He is telling you to do? What do the Scriptures say you should do? If what your pastor is telling you is contrary to the Word of God, then you need to do what is right according to the Lord - not your pastor!