Moshing

[TheMainException]

I am a Christian....but I really enjoy moshing at concerts....I've been to Creation...and we do it there....is it really a Christian thing to do? We are all real nice about it and pick each other up when we fall, we keep are fists and elbows down...we aren't out to hurt, just to really get the angst out...is it okay?

[greenonion]

There is nothing wrong with moshing. As long as it stay (relatively) tame and no one gets hurt, I don't see what is wrong with it. It's a good way to get out pent-up energy.

[abbygirlforever]

Ditto with what greenonion said! Moshing can be a lot of fun if you do it right!

[twistedsketch]

The way you described it, yes! In that sort of environment it's about being there for one another and having fun.

[TheMainException]

aw cool....I was hoping it wasn't some sort of thing where it was an act of violence or something like that.

[Tenorvoice]

cal me an old fuddy duddy, but I don't like it :(

[ghs1994]

I really like the band Disciple from Tennessee. I've talked with them several times, been to four concerts, have all their music, etc. Very Godly men, but don't care for the moshing. It may start innocent or whatever, but it doesn't take much to get emotions going and agressions flare up. Becareful. Something so innocent can become rage filled very quickly.

[fmsmom]

don't like it too easy to get out of control

[Tavita]

Nothing wrong with moshing at concerts, as long as you don't call it worship or praise.

[TheMainException]

I find it very interesting that the ones who don't like it are the older ones.....that sparks my interest greatly......older and wiser? Could be.....anyway.....I don't really care for your own opinion as much as I want to know whether or not it is God-like...so...if possible...take your opinion and form it a bit more from God perspective if you can....cause I have a hard time with the straight up opinions of people, especially since I can get those same opinions from my family members who throw negativity at me all day long and care nothing for whether it is enjoyable or not...my question is...is it okay with God?

[Tavita]

The word says not to fulfill the lusts of the flesh but to walk in the Spirit. We're to worship God in *Spirit* and in truth. It's a matter of being led by the Spirit of Jesus Christ who lives IN you. Listen to HIS voice and no other. Search the scriptures for yourself and see if these things be so... just like the Bereans, in Acts.



(Gal 5:18) But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law.

(Gal 5:19) Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: immorality, impurity, sensuality,

(Gal 5:20) idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, disputes, dissensions, factions,

(Gal 5:21) envying, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

(Gal 5:22) But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness,

(Gal 5:23) gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law.

(Gal 5:24) Now those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

(Gal 5:25) If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit.

(Gal 5:26) Let us not become boastful, challenging one another, envying one another.



Does moshing display the fruit of the Spirit? Is it gentle? Is there self control? These are the things you need to ask yourself and talk to the Lord about.

[ghs1994]

Many of us try to manipulate God's Word for our fleshly benefit. Fact: Moshing is not worship, as worship is to be done in spirit and in truth (John 4:24). Is it ok? Don't be surprised if many Christians frown on it as it may be culturally considered "worldly". Do you really want to defend moshing or the gospel? Do you want to be persecuted for moshing or for defending God's Word, preaching God's Word, etc.? I won't try and mold anyone, let the Word of God convict you of culturally based activities. Just because it's not in there, doesn't mean it's condoned. There are many things that were frowned upon in scripture that had to do with culture and were considered worldly.

[StAnselm]

I don't see how it could be called "worship" in any meaningful sense. And aren't we meant to worship God according to the way he tells us to?

we aren't out to hurt, just to really get the angst out...is it okay?

That might be a problem. Are there better ways of getting the angst out?

[twistedsketch]

When dealing with angst, I'm not sure there's any *good* way to get it out besides prayer if you're going to frown on moshing. If letting a some energy out when you're in control and respecting the people around you is bad, I'm not sure what could be good. Only when you stop doing those two things does it become bad, and if you find that you can't mosh while keeping control of yourself and respecting others, don't mosh. But if you can keep control of yourself and watch out not to really hurt anybody, I fail to see the sin in that.

Besides, who was ever arguing that moshing is worship? It would be no more or less worship than maintaining a good witness at work and treating people well at church. People will either see God or they will see flesh in that pit. If you're going to mosh, people should see God.

[TheMainException]

Hmm...maybe this should get moved to the debate forum....ah, no.....I sought your opinions and was foolish to do so....I believe you've warped what I've said......at no time did I EVER conclude that this was in any way related to any worshipful act to God...moshing is for personal purposes only....hurts happen...they can be accidental or purposeful. But when it comes to moshing.....in the mosh pits that I've been in...it hasn't been to hurt each other.....it's simply a form of dancing, a bit more wild than what you all consider actual dancing....but the fact is...if you've ever been in a real mosh pit....that it's not to hurt someone as much as it is to dance in a way that feels the muzik and the other people.....to get hot and sweaty with a bunch of other people and at no point ever be doing anything wrong.....it's not really to ever be doing something dangerous...I got hurt sure...but that's cause I have no balance and I stood on the outside to catch my breathe and was dumb (as it was my first time ) about it...I fell and got hurt.....but they picked me up and brushed me off and showed me to the med tent to get my bloody knee fixed up (stones are nasty stuff to land on)....but then I went back later and moshed and they held me in high esteem for being able to live with the pain and come back to the fun....it's fun....it's not trying to hurt people....I can tell that most of you who reject this don't know what moshing is about at all.....it HAS to have self control...if you don't, you'll get busted out of their so fast you won't know what happened. I don't see it as a sin...and I don't see something like this as ever being damaging to my walk with God...I actually made some really cool friends in the mosh pit and began to minister to them later...as they really didn't know God as well as I did and we talked for about 2 hours.....Who ever said that racket ball was WORSHIP??? Whoever said EATING FOOD was worship? If I have fun...am I sinning? In some cases yes...in many others, no.....so please.....tell me....is it okay?

[LiberatedChick]

at no time did I EVER conclude that this was in any way related to any worshipful act to God...

I believe worship is a lifestyle not a type of music, church service or specific act. Yes, it can be those things as well however, the dictionary also describes worship as honouring, loving and being devoted to a diety. Therefore everything we do should honour God, we should love Him and show our love and devotion in everything. We should worship Him at all times.

[twistedsketch]

You keep asking over and over, if its ok. And many people keep telling you over and over that they don't see that it is ok. You asked, and they answered. But you keep asking.. that says one thing: You don't want us to tell you if its ok or not. You simply want us to tell you "Yeah its ok, go ahead and do it." You don't WANT to hear that maybe its not ok..

Basically you are going to do what you want regardless of what we say, you are basically looking for justification for your actions, and that is not the proper motivation to ask a question. You have to be open to all points of view, the positive and the negative. If you are only going to do what you wanted to do anyway, then there is no point in asking.

Star is correct.. worship is a lifestyle. And *everything* we do should honor God. God does'nt turn his back at any second of the day. He isn't just watching during Church or when we pray.. He is eternally watching us in life. All your actions, your words, your behavior, should be honoring God. And sometimes we don't act in accordance with that standard, and thats ok because we make mistakes, we make poor judgement. And we have a forgiving God. But the question is when we do something that doesn't necessarily honor God, are we willing to recognize when we need to give it up? Or are we gonna do it anyway just because it feels good, and just ignore God.

We can't tell you what to do. We can only give an opinion or state scripture from the Bible, which also usually accompanies a person's opinion.

If you are truly looking for an answer to your question, weigh everyone's opinions and information equally. If you are going to only do what you want anyway, your post is irrelevant, and so are the answers you have received.

Did you ever think that the answer to prayers or to asking a question of God could come in the form of other human beings answering you? Think about that.. God doesn't answer us always with a big booming voice from the Heavens. He does so in other ways.. through our lives, through the people in our lives, He answers. Listen to everyone, weigh people's thoughts and actions and how they relate to you. If you are going to ask anything of God, or of another human being, you must be open to everything that is said and done towards getting you an answer.

God does not always give us favorable answers, He gives us truthful ones. So also, when you ask something of God, make sure you are open to His guidance as well.. because sometimes when we feel God disapproves of something in our lives, we also have a tendency to ignore it and do what we want anyway.

I'm not saying who is right and who is wrong with this post, I'm just saying you need to weigh every single piece of information, instead of simply looking for justification.

~ ~
Right, but we need to limit our "right and wrong" descisions to those that have a Biblical basis. Mosh pits aren't for everyone, but neither is football. Some people may not see "gentleness" but others see a strong expression of "joy." I think it's best to leave moshing where it belongs, in Romans 14 territory.

[Mr.Cheese]

Since I'm from the old school of thrash, by all means, mosh away.

[TheMainException]

Blue Impulse.....I am not try to bash you....I have had fitful life and do not blame my entire angry personality on that (no, I blame that on my dad...kidding....kidding...) but football is the same...yet there is a goal in mind....but then...mix football and dance and you have moshing....I do not believe you are from the world where moshing is liked...you seem to me to not really understand the essence of moshing...that is fine...not everyone needs to like the things I like (and I prefer it that way...cause that means overcrowded concerts and such! lol)....I respect your opinions, all of them....but what I was seeing was people saying "i don't really like moshing" and junk like that...and that was not stuff I cared to hear, cause really...I don't give a darn whether you LIKE it or not....that doesn't matter to me...what I want to know is whether it's okay to do....as far as I'm seeing an answer....I'm not seeing one....I'm seeing...it's not worshipful, I'm seeing, "go ahead, mosh away"....personally...the question might be worded quite badly.....whatever the reason.....It matters little.....:yawn:

[TheListener]

Wasn't there a verse "Thou shalt not mosheth at thy concerts"...?

:P

Sorry, didn't mean any disrespect, just putting my $0.02 in. Does it say in the Bible you shall not mosh?

I'd be worried if you were my age & still moshing though...

[TheMainException]

Wasn't there a verse "Thou shalt not mosheth at thy concerts"...?

:P

Sorry, didn't mean any disrespect, just putting my $0.02 in. Does it say in the Bible you shall not mosh?

I'd be worried if you were my age & still moshing though...

^_^ I've never seen that one!!

[TheListener]

^_^ I've never seen that one!!

Probably coz it doesn't exist.

Whats with your avatar? Looks pretty satanic to me :scratch:

[TheMainException]

Probably coz it doesn't exist.

Whats with your avatar? Looks pretty satanic to me :scratch:

oh...that...uh....well....it's a band that I listen to from time to time ....I'm gonna change it eventually...I just haven't gotten around to it...it's the band My Chemical Romance.....(they don't do drugs....anymore....)....*nervous laugh*....hahaha....yeah....so.....they are a bit satanic...they were raised catholic though, if that helps.....yeah...I'm a struggling Christian.:sorry:

[TheListener]

We all struggle. But God never dishes out more than we can handle. Not that anything evil comes from God. But what does come our way God gives us the strength to deal with it.

Hope that made sense. Feel free to PM me. I've been in the same circles you are in & I know what it's like.

[greenonion]

Maybe the problem is not with moshing itself, but with the feelings associated with it. For some people, moshing brings up images of skin heads, violence and music that does not glorify God. Of course this is not true in all circumstances, but that's what some people think.

The question is this: do you want people to associate these feelings with you when you say you participate in moshing?

You seem to have doubts about whether moshing (as you call it) is "ok." A good rule of thumb is this- if you have doubts whether something is "ok" or not, chances are it isn't. You wrote you are a struggling Christian. Perhaps your hestitation about moshing is coming from the Spirit. Is moshing something associated with your "old life" as a non-Christian, and bringing up old feelings or doubts? Actions can spark memories, which can spark doubts.

Just a brainstorm.

**********
And for the record- I'm not some old fogey who doesn't know what she's talking about. I'm actually not much older than you. And when we moshed, it certainly wasn't at Christian music festivals. ;)

[Justin761985]

I don't see you going to hell for doing it, but the best thing to ask yourself is: Would Christ go to these concerts and involve himself in this with you and enjoy it?

I don't like to get myself involved in anything that could lead to anger or violence against another fellow man, because that definitely wouldn't be Christ-like.

Sorry, one more thought: Before accepting Christ into my heart, I was deeply into Heavy Metal music and every concert I went to involved moshing... Would you want people associating you with that, even if it's not anything close to what you actually stand for?

God Bless,
Justin.

[TheMainException]

I can't see my parents having sex...but they did that didn't they? :eek: I can't see Jesus moshing...and for the most part...it has NOTHING to do with whether he agrees with it or not...it has to do with his preferences.....he wouldn't waste his time on earth moshing....but in heaven...sure!



Yes...I'm a struggling Christian, but I never had a life before Christ...I grew up in a Christian home...and the life before Christ was a boring life as a little kid.....I've been a Christian for quite some time now....about 7 years (hey to me that's "quite some time" considering I am ONLY 17....that's almost half my life!) I've only just moshed for the first time a few months ago...and LOVED it....I loved those who were with me...it was fun and games...(until someone gets hurt...I got hurt....but it was still fun)...we weren't as rough as people think. And really...I don't care WHAT people think about me. As of right now, I'm associated with and belong to the snobbiest group in the world...Christians. When that word is dropped in a club...they think..."oh great...another Jesus Freak coming to Bible thump again.....let's beat it" Yeah...great...that's what we want isn't it? NO...of course not....but I really don't care about the associated press....If people won't give me a chance to see who I am and what I'm REALLY about...that's THEIR PROBLEM. Not mine. Okay...so I'm not a new Christian...but I really didn't know where else to post this....it's not exactly a struggle as much as it is a question.....And many of you, you're darn right....what you say won't have a single effect on whether I mosh or not....cause, fact is...it's fun....and I believe God's okay with me moshing......but....I needed some opinions since I am not that great of a Christian at this moment in my life....faltering and going back and forth...so...yeah.....it helps to get some input. Thanks again.

[TheListener]

Just a quick reminder. Just because something is fun doesn't make it healthy for you.

Drugs are fun until they kill you. Lust is fun until it destroys your soul. Rage, chaos & violence is fun until you destroy yourself & others.

etc etc etc

Think if moshing is healthy for you or not. Only you can answer that.

[twistedsketch]

Yeah but by the same token, you can die from drinking too much water. I don't see how moshing is worse than football, and I don't see how football is sinful.

[TheMainException]

IT IS!?!?!?!?!?!? WOAH!

Yeah...I completely agree with TS....the point of football: to have fun The point of moshing: To have fun The GOAL of football: hmm...depends on the person....to the coach, usually to win....to the players....usually to win...sometimes it's to have fun or get in shape..... the GOAL of moshing: To have fun, enjoy the music, FEEL another person's body (not sexually) but to be close to others (and you don't need to come up with 50 million other ways...it is ONE way, I know)

[absolutely_lost_86]

i dont hve a prob with moshing

[KTskater]

Naw, I don't think it's a problem as long as no one get hurt. I try to start a mosh pit at all the concerts I go to. Even when my band is playing. Little concerts, medium concerts..the warp tour...
I got a bloody nose once but it wasn't intentional.

So, no I don't think God minds if we mosh.