Work of the deceiver?

[greenonion]

***I have no idea where to put this- moderators please move it to where you see fit. This thread is about a newly born again Christian (4-16-04) who thinks the deceiver is at work in her life and wants advice. Thank you******



If anyone has been over to non-Christian religions forum, they prolly have seen my posts questioning whether I am really a Christian. Things have been really really weird for me lately. Really weird. But I had a sort of epiphany the other day, after talking with one of the moderators (you know who you are). I wanted to run it by everyone for some advice.

I have been a "Christian" my entire life, or at least I thought I was. I have always gone to church (a mainline Protestant denomination), grew up in Sunday school, the normal stuff.

Then about a year and a half ago I started going to a non-denom church and was born again. I developed a strong relationship with Jesus Christ, He was my everything. I was baptized by immersion and was spirit-filled and in love with the Lord. It was like this up until a couple months ago when I moved to a different town, 20 miles away from my old church.

I took a couple weeks off from church while we got settled in. My prayer life began to suffer, and while I had frequent informal conversations with the Lord, my set "time devoted to the Lord" dissapeared. Then I found a church that was closer to my new home, and one that my sister-in-law would go to with me. It's a mainline denomination, same as the one I grew up in before I was born again. I didn't like this church all that much, but it was a "nice" church, just not Spirit-filled like my old one. Only one bible study for the whole church which I was dissapointed about, shaky preaching. It just didn't feed me spiritually. But I kept going because my sister-in-law went there and I thought it would be nice if the whole family could go to the same church.

I got a PM from a moderator asking why I had an "other religion" icon, yet I posted in the New Christian forum asking for Bible Study advice. This is true, I have always had trouble reading the Bible and I got some great advice in that thread (it's around here somewhere.)

I've always been liberal politically, but not spiritually. I've had trouble *understanding* the concept of the Trinity, but always understood that God is One, but manifests himself into 3 parts. I never doubted Jesus until a couple weeks ago.

Recently my strong faith was shattered. I went from not-understanding the Trinity, to not-believing in the Trinity, to doubting Jesus Lordship! It was like a complete faith collapse in the span of a few weeks. I became angry and hostile.

Could this be the work of the deceiver Using a chaotic time in my life (moving and leaving my church) to draw me away from the Lord?

[Bushmaster78FS]

I haven't known much about your past in Christian faith, so I am sorry about my direct comments on your posts however we shouldn't really be shaky on our faith and Jesus' truth. I am pretty much sure that non-Christian forum has introduced a lot of doubts regarding your faith. Remember Lord Jesus Christ has answer to everything and you shall find the answers if you shall seek. I had no problems regarding Trinity because it is drawn clearly in the Bible, it is even there when 3 angels appeared to Abraham in OT.

Satan whispers doubts into you but you need be strong. I Am not saying you should tell yourself, OK I believe in Jesus divinity, and I am shutting down my ears for anything that might give me doubt. No, pray for the Holy Spirit's enlightenment. Jesus' words and teachings really fit into their spots during hard times of life, keep reading them.

Pour your heart out here, the more we know, the more we can pray about it. You know people here loves you as does Jesus...

[greenonion]

Thank you for answering Bushmaster. I listen to Christian radio while in the car to work. I have for a while now. The other day I was driving to work, singing along with the car when it hit me- "what was happening to me?!" Just a month ago I was reading the Bible daily, going to a church I loved and really felt close to God. I was part of another Christian forum and discussed Scriptures and Jesus almost daily with my co-worker.

Listening to K-Love on the radio the other day and realizing what I had been saying/thinking really hit me like a ton of bricks. Now I am unsure whether I really believed at all. I am unsure of everything. During the time I sure believed- on another forum I belong to I used to debate a Catholic person about salvation and works and was very passionate. Now look at me!


I am planning on going back to my church this Sunday and going up for the alter call.

[Bushmaster78FS]

Sometimes a similar thing happens to me and I find myself thinking about what if the world is something similar to the movie Matrix? Or sometimes I think, what if people of the time, really thought Jesus who actually was an alien in human disguise as god? What if this all god thing is staged by aliens? These are the thoughts and doubts raised by the flesh and its connection to this world, has to reason somehow and explain God who is out of our boundaries, out of our time. Of course when my prayers are answered or a miracle happens certainly space aliens has no role in that.

You might have been very strong in your faith and something similar to an emotional "stigmata" might be happening to you. Read the book of Job, remember what happened to him. Try to question the reasons, and bring the reasons out here...

[Bushmaster78FS]

Also yes discussing this with the pastor will help.

If you have deeper questions about the history of Christianity, I am here to answer with my librarian friend, we are very interested in Church history.

[greenonion]

Bushmaster friend- You mean the reasons why I doubted?

[twistedsketch]

Keep going to your old church, the Spirit-filled one. That is always the kind of church we need to be in, and it's only a 20-30 minute drive. Get involved in it again, and begin your time with God again. If your sister-in-law is worth her salt as a believer, she will understand that you're just not being fed at her church and you need to go elsewhere.

[greenonion]

twistedsketch-

I really still have trouble with the idea that non-believers are damned to hell. I understand that it is because they haven't been forgiven, and I know how sin came into the world. I know why we need a savior.

Adam and Eve disobeyed God in the garden and they brought sin into the world. This sinful nature has been passed down to the rest of humanity. I understand why God would want to punish Adam and Eve by kicking them out of the garden, but why the rest of humanity? Why do we have to be punished for what they did?

[kdet]

This is really tough. Giving advice to people is a huge responsibility. But I'll do my best to tell you my thoughts.
If you read through the biographies of people in the Church you'll see that many people have had crises of faith. I feel like our relationship with God is like a marriage. There is the honeymoon phase and then a "cooling" off phase. But we have to remember that God is constant even if we are not. The best way to keep your relationship alive is to feed it. Read God's word daily, study it, meditate on it. Talk to God daily, pray, tell Him how you are feeling, what your doubts are, He is there for you always, He listens and He cares.
Go to a church where you feel fed. There is nothing worse than attending a church where you are going through the motions and not feeling the Holy Spirit. Go to different churches until you find what you need. We move fairly often because of my husband's work and we seek out different churches until we find the one we feel will give us what we need.
If there is any other way I can help you please let me know.
I'll be praying for you.
Kathy

[If Not For Grace]

"however we shouldn't really be shaky on our faith and Jesus' truth."

We start as babes and grow. Do not worry about what you did or did not believe yesterday, but start w/today and go forward.

Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God. Find a church that is more to your liking, but just continue to go.. Surrond yourself with the spititual and yes the enemy will attack through your mind. Ask God to help you build your faith and reveal himself to you.

My own persoanl view of the trinity is something like Water.

It's ALL Water,,, but water comes in forms like ice, steam etc. depending on your need or its function you use the different types, but its all h20.

May God Bless...

[twistedsketch]

twistedsketch- I don't think sister in law is a believer. She has not been born again. Up until a couple months ago I would witness to her and give her books to read, like 'More than a Carpenter' and 'How Good is Good Enough.' She's not a believer, just a church goer. I started to rationalize my going to church with her, thinking " this church is better than no church."
Then you should go back to the old church anyway, and maybe take her along. First though, you've got to get your faith solid again.


I really still have trouble with the idea that non-believers are damned to hell. I understand that it is because they haven't been forgiven, and I know how sin came into the world. I know why we need a savior.

Adam and Eve disobeyed God in the garden and they brought sin into the world. This sinful nature has been passed down to the rest of humanity. I understand why God would want to punish Adam and Eve by kicking them out of the garden, but why the rest of humanity? Why do we have to be punished for what they did?
Doubts are common. But do realize that we sin so much that we don't even need original sin to be worthy of hell. We're not being blamed for what Adam and Eve did - we just have the same tendency, and because of that tendency every human being has come into their own as a sinner.

[greenonion]

Wow, thanks everyone!! I definitly will go back to the spirit-filled church. I love it there and it really fed my faith. Dyanm I really like your water analogy!

Thanks for the support and advice everyone. I do have issues I need to get past, but luckily I have a lot of resources to help me along the way, including a great study bible. Sometimes I don't understand some of the deep theological issues like sin and the Trinity.

Have you ever felt the deceiver work in your life? How do you combat it?

[twistedsketch]

The way I fight the devil in matters of faith is first having a firm belief that the Bible has the truth, no adding or subtracting (see my sig). Then I memorize Scripture in context so that the truth is burned into my brain and written on my heart. This gives him no wiggle room. That is how Jesus stood up to him in the desert, and that is how we are to guard our hearts (Proverbs 4:23, Psalm 119:9). Of course, pray that you will be strong as well. Prayer cannot be neglected.

[Bushmaster78FS]

Bushmaster friend- You mean the reasons why I doubted?

Yes, those reasons...

[Bushmaster78FS]

It's ALL Water,,, but water comes in forms like ice, steam etc. depending on your need or its function you use the different types, but its all h20.

This doesn't really work, I am sorry, for a discussion on this I would give you a link and greenonion please read the discussion at this link.

http://new.carmforums.org/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=115&topic_id=13996&mesg_id=13996&page=

When you go there on the top click on "Collapse topics | View in linear mode" options that would give you a much better thread flow.

[Radagast]

... My prayer life began to suffer, and while I had frequent informal conversations with the Lord, my set "time devoted to the Lord" dissapeared...
Most Christians have had times like this (I certainly have). And yes, it is the the work of the deceiver. But God uses other Christians to help us through, and I hope we can do that for you.

.. I've had trouble *understanding* the concept of the Trinity, but always understood that God is One, but manifests himself into 3 parts. I never doubted Jesus until a couple weeks ago.
Everyone has trouble understanding the Trinity -- nobody fully understands it. The Nicene Creed summarises what we know about it from the Bible.

God bless you,

-- Radagast

[Radagast]

If you have deeper questions about the history of Christianity...
You might also look at http://members.ozemail.com.au/~dekker/essays/history.html

-- Radagast

[Bushmaster78FS]

Greenonion, there is no doubt that you love people. That was your attitude in the non-christian forum. But we can see that those people are not saved and are currently lost. Some of them have hardened hearts and they closed themselves to Lord's Word, these will be speaking against Christ and His good news and of course the enemy will use these people to give you doubts. Remember Thomas, he doubted that Lord had resurrected. Not saying that he was speaking like that because of the enemy, but we all do doubt.

I was born in a predominantly muslim country and lived my life confessing and believing in Allah and his prophet Muhammad. My life changed in 2002 when I got to know Jesus Christ whom was really different than what I have ever known. For a long time, I had my serious doubts because of the clash of faiths, but I continued to study the Word in the bible. I had visions also that helped me. I never ruled out Trinity because it didn't make sense to me rather I prayed that God will give me the wisdom and knowledge I need, still I never hoped to fully grasp what God really is, how can I figure out someone who is not even bound to my time and space? We can have knowledge of God through His Word.

I am sure you have had your doubts because of the non-christian people raising issues within Christianity, you know those issues are NOTHING new at all, they all have their answers, God has not forsaken us and will never do so.

I am hoping and will pray that you will come back to non-christian forums as a strong Christian in faith and share your faith and show thr truth to them.

[Bushmaster78FS]

Have you ever felt the deceiver work in your life? How do you combat it?

It works in my life through pornography, I am not really ashamed of it, I know the enemy is making me feel bad and whispering to me that I am not worth anything in God's eyes with this nasty addiction. I do pray about it and ask God to remove that addiction from my heart but still stumble upon it, what happens is this time enemy whispers, look he is not even answering your prayer. I am faithfully waiting. I will defeat this addiction one day. That is how the enemy works, most don't know his ways and say OK I am an unworthy person, I am addicted to porn, I should just quit on God, no we should continue to pray and confess to God and also confess to others that we are having problems. God will come through for you. You combat it by praying and trusting God...

[Radagast]

Thanks for all the replies on this thread, helping "to mend broken wings." :thumbsup:

-- Radagast

[Bushmaster78FS]

Strange, how did you know my unit MOTTO? :) :) :)

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/agency/army/images/602asb.gif

That is my unit crest which I wear on my beret now.

[Radagast]

A good metaphor for Christians helping each other...

[Bushmaster78FS]

I definitely agree.

[greenonion]

Wow, thank you everyone! Thank you for openness and for your thorough responses. This is a wonderful thread.

Right now I am immersing myself in the Word and Jesus-centered entertainment. I need to get strong again, and you all are a life-saver. I found another really good Christian music station in my area (besides K-Love) and am listening to it instead of secular. I'm also started a bible study tonight with my husband (I need to pick one out though!).

I'm in university and one of the requirements for my degree is a class on religious philosophy and applying it to the major world religions. It is a very intensive course and decided to drop it and focus on getting well. For entertainment reading one of my strongly Christian co-workers recommended me a book called "Classic Christianity" by Bob George. Here is the review on Amazon (I'm not selling or promoting sale of this book, but this is the only review I can find) http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0736904190/ref=pd_sxp_f/002-9779168-1505616?v=glance&s=books.

So I'm diving in! Thank you all for your support and help!

[Bushmaster78FS]

Helping "to mend broken wings." Anytime, anywhere!