Debate backup please...

[AlikhnKwizad]

Ok, there is a person ("ex-Jew" now christian) who is trying to engage in debate about how G-d doesn't see the Jews as Jews anymore, etc.

It's in OUTREACH : Questions by Nonchristians: "The Chosen People: This Bugs Me"

I've asked him to PM me or go to a debate forum... He has/ will not.

Anyone out there willing to give some input? Please?? :D

There is just too much info he is bring up to cover... like, uh, people have written books on the subject...!

[visionary]

That is a tough one.

[A_Pioneer]

What is your real question, for he(ex Jew now Christian) has the whole of Pauls writings.
Ro 10:12 ¶ For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.
Ga 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus.
Col 3:11 where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcised nor uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave nor free, but Christ is all and in all.

Is your question "Should he remain a Jew?"
1Co 7:17 ¶ Only, let every one lead the life which the Lord has assigned to him, and in which God has called him. This is my rule in all the churches.18 Was any one at the time of his call already circumcised? Let him not seek to remove the marks of circumcision. Was any one at the time of his call uncircumcised? Let him not seek circumcision.19 For neither circumcision counts for anything nor uncircumcision, but keeping the commandments of God.20 Every one should remain in the state in which he was called.
It is his choice if he wishes to give up his Hebrew Heritage. (Esau and Jacob)
But if his contention is Christians are under grace, thereby free fron the Torah. This is a form of godliness. In the Hebrew writings there are three books, book of the righteous, the book of the wicked and the book of the intermidiates.
NT, you find three types of people written of the Godly, the ungodly and a from of godliness.

The Hebrew writings say the first two books are sealed! One book to be judged.

Da 7:10 A fiery stream issued And came forth from before Him. A thousand thousands ministered to Him; Ten thousand times ten thousand stood before Him. The court was seated, And the books were opened.
Rev 20:11 ¶ Then I saw a great white throne and him who sat upon it; from his presence earth and sky fled away, and no place was found for them.12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Also another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, by what they had done.

IMHO one should strive for election! The book of the righteous.

[BarbB]

.... deleted by me. I misread the situation - sorry! :sorry:

[Bon]

Ok, there is a person ("ex-Jew" now christian) who is trying to engage in debate about how G-d doesn't see the Jews as Jews anymore, etc.

It's in OUTREACH : Questions by Nonchristians: "The Chosen People: This Bugs Me"

I've asked him to PM me or go to a debate forum... He has/ will not.

Anyone out there willing to give some input? Please?? :D

There is just too much info he is bring up to cover... like, uh, people have written books on the subject...!

Where to start? There is so much "Christianity" in his understanding of scripture.

I will give some input with time, as some thoughtful responses are required. (not even sure I have the capacity to answer such a person). But I do see many holes in his scriptural understandings.

Shalom from Bon

[AlikhnKwizad]

I could get out all my books & really get into it with him... take up a lot of time I don't have to spare... But I really just don't want to.

Frankly, it saddens me that he has rejected his Jewishness... and not because "Jew" is better... It's just part of who he is... and from my perspective it's like cutting off an arm or something...

From what I know, I am part English, Irish, and Cherokee (and perhaps a little African thrown in, although there is no proof.) I do not deny those aspects of who I am because now I am in Messiah. I find the mix of cultures within my own self a blessing... because I am able to see things from different perspectives... I am secure in my "Gentile-ness" and I seek G-d to reveal His purpose for my life- how I am to bless HIM. And I am in no way threatened by Jews being "chosen" for a specific role in world history.

The crazy thing is when people ditch their heritage because they believe G-d wants to form some kind of mass produced, borg type religion... where everyone is the same... but that just doesn't work does it? Because we are ALL bias in some way. We ALL have cultural attachments.

This guy probably does Christmas (and I"m not bashing christams here)... but he traded in the feasts G-d gave his people for some unbiblical celebration...

The reason I don't do christams is because I chose to become one with my husbands people... and I see no scriptural support for the celebration of it. Now, if my parents want to put up a tree, does it bother me? Not really.

It's your thing, do what you want to do... I can't tell ya who to sock it too.... ^_^hahaah... ok, it shabbat. Enough of this... I'm going swimming.

I'll finish this thought later.

[Bon]

I could get out all my books & really get into it with him... take up a lot of time I don't have to spare... But I really just don't want to.

I have to say ditto to that Nilahk.....he is in this 50's and has been a christain for 30+ years.

He has much of the traditions and doctrines of christianity engrained into his very being. I checked out his church web site and their doctrinal statement.

http://www.berachahbiblechurch.org/ds.htm

I'm not sure where to start....not to mention if he cares to listen at all to what you or I would have say.

It saddens me too, to hear that he was convinced by other's to turn his back on his Jewish roots, and take on a "new" and "different" religion to the very one that Yahshua obeyed and taught His followers.

As you said at the closing of your post:
It's your thing, do what you want to do

It's his choice, he believes it is the right one.

I will certainly keep watch of his posts and will prayerfully reply if Yahweh so leads me to.

Shalom from Bon

[AlikhnKwizad]

You are very right- Thanks!

[Henaynei]

"a man (or woman) convinced against his will, is of the same opinon still..."

[AlikhnKwizad]

That's right Henaynei-

I'm done. I'm through. I am where I am in my walk... and I keep on walking.

And where he is, who knows but him & G-d.

And in the end, really, only G-d knows where any of us will end up spiritually.

So, whatever, dude. Go do your own research... I've got other things to do.

OY!
Thanks for the insight & advice!!!

[Henaynei]

through many painful years of experience as a MJ I have found that the most successful method of communicating with Christians (and most everyone else for that matter) about MJism is to wait until they come to you and ask a question - answer the question as directly and simply as possible and then wait - for HaRuakh to move on them again and move them to ask another question - in HaShem's time... not ours ;)

[AlikhnKwizad]

SO TRUE!!!!!!!!!! That is the ONLY way.

But some christians won't just be satisfied with the answer "You have your view, I have mine."

They think we are some crazy cult & they want to make sure we are "saved" and don't fall into deception. :preach:

My husbands entire family is like that... they will throw out scripture here & there... then avoid confrontation... or totally tune out our answer!!! And a month later... here come the same verses again. :doh:

GO LOOK IT UP YOURSELF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Don't WASTE MY TIME if your heart has not been drawn to it. LET IT GO & LEAVE US ALONE!!!!!!!!!!! :mad: :sigh: