Greek LXX and Greek NT

[Cary.Melvin]

I was just wondering.

Could a normal person that lives in Greece today read the Greek LXX and the Greek NT?

Has the Greek language changed much over the past 2000 years?

Thanks,

[Dust and Ashes]

I was just wondering.

Could a normal person that lives in Greece today read the Greek LXX and the Greek NT?

Has the Greek language changed much over the past 2000 years?

Thanks,

Funny you should ask that. I was just talking with O-usa's godfather yesterday and asked him the very same question. He said that there have been quite a few changes but that a modern Greek can still read it, though it requires effort. Much like an American with no exposure to the Bible trying to read a 1611 KJV Bible I would imagine. If not more profound.

[Cary.Melvin]

So I guess it is not as bad as trying to read Old and Middle English




The Our Father in Old English:


Fæder ure þu þe eart on heofonum, Si þin nama gehalgod. to becume þin rice, gewurþe ðin willa, on eorðan swa swa on heofonum. urne gedæghwamlican hlaf syle us todæg, and forgyf us ure gyltas, swa swa we forgyfað urum gyltendum. and ne gelæd þu us on costnunge, ac alys us of yfele. soþlice.


The Our Father in Middle English:


Oure fadir that art in heuenes, halewid be thi name; thi kyngdoom come to; be thi wille don in erthe as in heuene; yyue to vs this dai oure breed ouer othir substaunce; and foryyue to vs oure dettis, as we foryyuen to oure dettouris; and lede vs not in to temptacioun, but delyuere vs fro yuel. Amen.

[icxn]

I was just wondering.

Could a normal person that lives in Greece today read the Greek LXX and the Greek NT?

Has the Greek language changed much over the past 2000 years?

Thanks,

Where I come from, people not only can they read it but also speak it. ;)

Has the Greek language changed much over the past 2000 years? Nope.

icxn

[Marjorie]

So I guess it is not as bad as trying to read Old and Middle English





The Our Father in Old English:



Fæder ure þu þe eart on heofonum, Si þin nama gehalgod. to becume þin rice, gewurþe ðin willa, on eorðan swa swa on heofonum. urne gedæghwamlican hlaf syle us todæg, and forgyf us ure gyltas, swa swa we forgyfað urum gyltendum. and ne gelæd þu us on costnunge, ac alys us of yfele. soþlice.


The Our Father in Middle English:


Oure fadir that art in heuenes, halewid be thi name; thi kyngdoom come to; be thi wille don in erthe as in heuene; yyue to vs this dai oure breed ouer othir substaunce; and foryyue to vs oure dettis, as we foryyuen to oure dettouris; and lede vs not in to temptacioun, but delyuere vs fro yuel. Amen.


Probably much closer to Middle English--> Modern English. Unlike English, Greek hasn't had any Old French invade it in the past 2000 years. :)

In IC XC,
Marjorie

[prodromos]

I was just wondering.

Could a normal person that lives in Greece today read the Greek LXX and the Greek NT?

Has the Greek language changed much over the past 2000 years?

Thanks,
Up until around 20 years ago, everyone with a standard high school education in Greece could read Koine Greek without much difficulty. Then the Socialist government made Ancient Greek optional in school, indeed in many schools it was not even an option, so there are now a couple of generations who have a lot of difficulty reading Koine Greek. The current government is trying to reverse the trend and is once more making Ancient Greek compulsary :clap:

Pronunciation has changed a bit over the last couple of millenia. When Greeks read Koine, they do so with modern pronunciation and no attempt is made to try and reconstruct the ancient pronunciation. There wasn't one Greek language spoken in ancient Greece but a number of local dialects which each had its own peculiar grammatical constructs and spelling.

Ancient Greek
1200-400 B.C.

DIALECTS (five main dialects found on inscriptions; based on geography; with regional subdivisions)

1. Attic-Ionic (represented in literature)
* Ionic
o East Ionic
o Central Ionic
o West Ionic
* Attic
2. Achaean
* Arcadian
* Cyprian
* Pamphylian
3. Aeolic (represented in literature)
* Lesbian
* Thessalian
* Boeotian
4. Doric (represented in literature)
* Laconian-Heraclean
* Messenian
* Argolic
* Megarian,
* Corinthian
* Rhodian
* Theran-Melian
* Coan-Calymnian
* Cretan
5. Northwest Greek
* Phocian
* Locrian
* Elean

Koine
4th C B.C. to 4th C A.D., the language of the New Testament and Septuagint, spread by the empire of Alexander the Great. Based on Attic.

Byzantine
5th - 15th C A.D.

Modern Greek
15th C to the present

Despite what icxn says, the language has changed a fair bit over 2000 years, but not so much that it is not recognisable as the same language. A language that does not change is a dead language, and Greek is very much alive, though remarkably resistant to dramatic change, probably because of the central role the scriptures have played in the life of Greeks over the centuries.

John

[prodromos]

Unlike English, Greek hasn't had any Old French invade it in the past 2000 years. :)
It does have a few Turkish loan words now though ;)

[sin_vladimirov]

Ok, time for Slavic Propaganda!


Word GREEK is one of the rare english words that is slavic in origin.

When ancient southern Slavs moved on the north-western borders of the Eastern Roman Empire to settle and call it home, during VII century and after, among many fine things of the land, they found some inconveniences. Their neighbours for start. ^_^

Love was developed slowly.
After the Orthodoxy was spread among Slavic tribes by... hm... greeks.

It is amazing that two nations that had so many wars between like Slavs and Greeks are so close today. This closeness started developing after X century.

Anyway, Greeks are not really Greeks, they are HELLENS or ELLENS. The word GREEK is of ancient Slavic origin and is still in use today. The name was given to HELLENS, by the Slavs who in this name presented the feelings that they had towards their venerable neighbours and later Fathers in the faith.

Word GREEK comes from slavic GRK (GORAK) which translates to english as BITTER.^_^ This is the way ancient fathers saw our neighbours.

Later the feeling changed, radically, but the name stuck.

Today, we tend not to tell this to anyone, because there is so much love between two peoples that it would be unfair for us to remind our brothers about the long gone past.

Of course, at time like when Basketball or Waterpollo teams play, we tend to forget the love towards each-other take off the gloves and 'have a go'.^_^

So, there you go.




Of course all this about Greek being a slavic word could be a bunch of nothing. Maybe slavs did not have word for bitter until they meet Greeks.^_^

Who knows? :D

[icxn]

...

Ancient Greek
1200-400 B.C.

DIALECTS (five main dialects found on inscriptions; based on geography; with regional subdivisions)
1. Attic-Ionic (represented in literature)* Ionico East Ionic
o Central Ionic
o West Ionic* Attic2. Achaean* Arcadian
* Cyprian :thumbsup:
* Pamphylian
Despite what icxn says, the language has changed a fair bit over 2000 years, but not so much that it is not recognisable as the same language.

John

Hehe... John is right, syntax and word endings have changed (in modern Greek), word roots are mostly the same, however there are some dialects out there that not only kept the syntax and the vocabulary (including word endings) the same but also the pronunciation... "Ανταν αρκεψαν οι ανέμοι τζαι φυσούσαν, τζ' αρκήνεψεν είς την Τουρτζιά να σιγοσυννεφκίαζει είσχεν τζιαν είχαν ούλλοι τους τζ' η Τζύπρου το μερτικό της..."

:)

PS. Btw Greeks in Cicilie (Italy) that were isolated for centuries have a pronunciation that sounds amazingly the same as Cyprian, which is an indication that we have preserved the ancient soundings. Needless to say that when Greek Cypriots speak Greek Greeks do not understand them... ;)

[prodromos]

Needless to say that when Greek Cypriots speak Greek Greeks do not understand them... ;)Don't I know it. My pnevmatiko is Cypriot and I sometimes have a real hard time understanding him ;)

[StChristopherofPalestine]

Ok, time for Slavic Propaganda!

That's the best opening line ever! :D

[ExOrienteLux]

What kind of Slavic Propoganda? You mean this kind?

"In Soviet Russia, clothes fold themself!"
"In Soviet Russia, oven cook food!"
"In Soviet Russia, car drive itself!"

Or do you mean some other kind of Slavic Propoganda, like "Vodk... er, water is better than slivov... um, water" or vice versa?

-Philip.

[Matrona]

What kind of Slavic Propoganda? You mean this kind?

"In Soviet Russia, clothes fold themself!"
"In Soviet Russia, oven cook food!"
"In Soviet Russia, car drive itself!"

"In California, you can always find a party. In Soviet Russia, the Party can always find you!"

"In America, you watch television. In Soviet Russia, television watches you!"