Conversion

[feo]

Was everyone here born Coptic, or did they convert?

[minasoliman]

I was born Coptic. I know of many though who did convert, although I don't know about here.

God bless.

[feo]

I was born Coptic. I know of many though who did convert, although I don't know about here.

God bless.

Hm... I wonder if anyone here has....

[CopticGirl]

Most the Coptic people I have spoken to on here were born Coptic, including myself. If you go on www.coptichymns.net (http://www.coptichymns.net), they have a forum there and I believe there are a few converts on there.

God Bless,
Elizabeth

[domi]

I FEAL SPEICAL!!!!!!!!!! lol. I wasn't born coptic...how could u people forget about me...o the unlovedness. lol. I converted :) YAY ME! well not with the ucky oil and all but in my heart so still.. YAY ME!!!!!!!!! lol

[CopticGirl]

I FEAL SPEICAL!!!!!!!!!! lol. I wasn't born coptic...how could u people forget about me...o the unlovedness. lol. I converted :) YAY ME! well not with the ucky oil and all but in my heart so still.. YAY ME!!!!!!!!! lol

Domi, It's not "ucky oil" its Holy Oil called myron, through which you receive the Holy Spirit.

God Bless,
Elizabeth

[feo]

pshaw I was born Catholic, accepted Christ in a protestant Church, and am now attending a Coptic Church :P Hows that for variety? :angel:

[CopticGirl]

pshaw I was born Catholic, accepted Christ in a protestant Church, and am now attending a Coptic Church :P Hows that for variety? :angel:

Looks like you've had a little taste of everything then!

Any new thoughts on the Coptic Church?

God Bless,
Elizabeth

[domi]

Domi, It's not "ucky oil" its Holy Oil called myron, through which you receive the Holy Spirit.

God Bless,
Elizabeth

sry..i'm not an oil person...:(... I kinda fela bad now..sry guys.

[Xpycoctomos]

feo... are you thinking of converting? Sorry, that's kind of personal, feel free to ignore it... I'm just curious :)

[feo]

feo... are you thinking of converting? Sorry, that's kind of personal, feel free to ignore it... I'm just curious :)

I think that God wants me to belong to a Church, and currently I'm leaning more towards the Coptic one. Honestly though, I'm not too concerned with the theology; I'm just looking for a place with a strong faithful and loving community...

The coptic Church nearby is just beautiful; even the college students are very devoted... and I like the sense of brotherhood everyone has.

For me personally, my conversion has little to do with a particular Church's theology; (although the Priest who is discipling me believes otherwise, he feels the theology is very important... hm, we'll see how it goes :angel: )

[Xpycoctomos]

You would be hardpressed to find an Orthodox priest who believed that theology weren't that important.

Just remember that in becoming Catholic, Coptic or Eastern Orthodox, you making a lifelong commitment... you are saying you will you live for that Church and die for that Church. You are saying you believe that that Church is the fullest expression of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church on Earth and that it is that very Church that Christ gave us. These Churches mentioned believe in what is called a visible Church with visible boundaries. I'm sure you have seen the thread in which many of us (Coptics and Eastern Orthodox) hope for reunification and believe that perhaps the split is more political than theological... but even so, we are to be obedient to our bishops. Exempting extenuating circumstances, not even we would have the right to waltz down to a Parish of the other persuasion and take communion. We must respect and be obedient to our bishops' decision that we are not yet in communion.

I guess I am just rambling on about this because it is important that you realize that if you become Coptic or Eastern Orthodox or Catholic, it meant to be treated as the last stop... like a marriage. It's not like going to a protestant Church and deciding on becomoing this or that denomination because it fits where you are at this point in your journey towards Christ.... this is it... this is the promised land (and if you don't feel it is, then chrismation isn't for you... yet ;)) Now it is about you conforming to the Church (a constant battle that takes over your whole life... and it is glorious even if difficult) and no longer about finding a Church that fits you.

I hope you don't take any of this as preachy or scolding. It's totally not meant to be. I think you are doing good in being cautious at the moment to say that you are not definitely converting but jsut taht you are comfortable. This is good for now. Who knows where it will lead you... but I wouldn't even consider chrismation until/unless you feel one day that, hell or high water, this is where God is calling you to live and die. This is the true Church and even when I don't understand her teachings, I will submit myself to them, for She is the pillar and ground of truth. :)

God bless you man... this is exciting!

John

[erinipassi]

Hi John

Although I know it’s not your intention to be offensive, some of the comments you made I find are highly offensive and insensitive. When a person wants to get to know an Orthodox Church, any Orthodox person should not discourage them from getting to know Orthodoxy. If a person was trying to know the Eastern Orthodox Church, you would not venture to tell them in an Eastern Orthodox Forum, “I think you are doing good in being cautious at the moment to say that you are not definitely converting but jsut taht you are comfortable. This is good for now. Who knows where it will lead you...”.



This statement is not only offensive, but you are telling those who are wanting to know Coptic Orthodoxy that Coptic Orthodox do not have the fullness of Faith and it isn’t Orthodox. You have the right to believe whatever you like John and you have the right and freedom to think whatever you choose, but you do not have the right to come in to a Coptic Orthodox Forum and caution people against the Coptic Orthodox Church.



How insulting it would be if I went to the Eastern Orthodox Forums and told people indirectly who are interested in Eastern Orthodox that Eastern Orthodox does not have the Fullness of Faith and “who knows where God may lead you next”. Meaning that Eastern Orthodox may not be their final stop since it does not have the fullness of faith. What would you feel if someone did that in an Eastern Orthodox Forum???



Your message is indirectly saying since you view the Coptic Orthodox Church as heretical in obedience to your bishops, then people are best not to enter the Coptic Orthodox Church. You are in a Coptic Orthodox Forum, John. Just because we are gentle people, don’t try to take advantage of our kindness by throwing indirect insults. You are free to post your opinions in the Eastern Orthodox Forums and insult us to your heart’s content, but you have no right to insult us and discourage new comers who are interested in Coptic Orthodoxy in a Coptic Orthodox Forum.



If people are asking the Coptic and Oriental Orthodox People for particular answers in Coptic and Oriental Forum, then a non-Oriental Orthodox cannot answer on behalf of Coptic Orthodox about Coptic Orthodox theology or Church practice because it will be inaccurate. But non-Oriental Orthodox can answer these same questions from their own Church’s point of view. Example, if someone asks about baptism in a Coptic Orthodox forum, a person who is Eastern Orthodox can answer this question by saying, “In Eastern Orthodox teaching…”. An Eastern Orthodox cannot for example speak on behalf of the Coptic Orthodox teachings since they have not studied Coptic Orthodox sources.



Since we are not allowed to voice our opinion or clarify ourselves in an Eastern Orthodox Forum, the least an Eastern Orthodox can do when visiting the Coptic and Oriental Orthodox Forum, is to be respectful of our Church. Treat others the same way that you want your Church and yourself to be treated.



I am telling you all this because as I said to you before I am tired of seeing such judgemental attitudes towards the Coptic Orthodox Church. Isn’t it enough that we suffer so much persecution from Muslims and verbal persecution from protestants? How much more can people add to our suffering just because we are faithful to every word that is said in the first three Ecumenical Councils. Just because we are faithful to the third Ecumenical Councils teachings headed by St. Cyril and the terminology that was agreed on in the third Ecumenical Council that said, “One Incarnate Nature of God the Logos".

We bring our Coptic sufferings, our pain and tears to our Lord Jesus, and say with him on the Cross, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they do” (Luke 23: 34)



I ask for your forgiveness if I have offended you in any way, and to pray for me.



Love and blessings

erini

[Xpycoctomos]

...

[feo]

Man, I start trouble even when I *dont* want to!

Thats scary :eek:

[Xpycoctomos]

The post that was here has seen its time and is no longer necessary. Let me just say that I respect your Church and I hope we reconcile one day soon.

Feo, good luck on your journey and God bless you if you find your home with the Copts, and if this is so, treat it like a rare diamond that you wouldn't give up for the world. If you ask me, you are in wonderful hands.

God bless,

John

[CopticGirl]

I think some of us Copts are a little hurt by some of the things some EO's said about us. For two that are so similar, the divison is just so sad. I feel like we are arguing over nothing. As Erini said, think about how much grief we get from some Catholics, Protestants and of course Muslims...you'd think we would be able to stand strong together.

Personally, John, through all of the conversations I've had with EO's, I've always appreciated your approach. You have never judged us, and have treated us with nothing but warmth and kindness. You seem to look at things from a neutral point of view, and have never told me I was not welcome on your forum (as others have :( ). I truly appreciate the way you have treated us, John.

God Bless,
Elizabeth

[Shirija]

I come from an Full Gospel Non-Denom background and am courting a Copt. I was just wondering if any of you who said that you converted could share some of your experiances. I've been to a Coptic service and it was REALLY different than anything I've ever been to. I'm used to. . . well, Full Gospel. Besides, I don't understand Arabic or Coptic, so that's hard. And then there's the English--I could just barely understand what the Abuna (sp?) was saying through his thick accent. It seems to me that the Coptic Church follows the tradition of the Jews and the Catholics by reading from prayer books and pre-selected passages. But what about if God brings up a "now word" as we call them? If the Spirit wants an issue addressed that can be found by studying the book of Hebrews, what happens if the passage to be read is from Leviticus? Or what about women pastors? What about Gal. 3:28? I just want to hear how you handeled these things as well as the other technicalities between different denominational faith. Thanks.

[minasoliman]

Dear Erini,

I think John didn't mean to disrespect our Church in any way. I think he was just letting Feo know that if he's going to be in a Church, it is not just to "fit in" but to believe that this is the TRUE Church. I don't think he suggested not finding it in the Coptic Church.

Dear John,

Please understand that sometimes there are frustrations, and we can be a bit jumpy. So please explain if we misunderstood anything from you.

I gotta get going to study for an exam. Pray for me.

God bless.

Xrictoc anecti.

[Xpycoctomos]

Thanks for your understanding Minasoliman. I will try to be more understanding in the future.

John

[erinipassi]

Hi Shirija,

Welcome to the Coptic Orthodox Forum. :wave: Although I was born into the Coptic Orthodox Church, I can understand how difficult it must be for you trying to understand the different aspects about Coptic Orthodoxy. I may not be able to help you as much as a convert can, but I can try to explain to you to the best of my abilities about Coptic Orthodoxy.

To try to understand Orthodoxy in general we have to go back to the beginning to the Apostolic Era and look at Church history. St. Mark the Apostle, who wrote the Gospel of St. Mark, established the Coptic Orthodox in Egypt and he is our first Patriarch or Pope. While the Antiochian Orthodox and Armenian Orthodox in Turkey was established by St. Paul the Apostle. St. Paul also established other Orthodox Churches. Each Orthodox Church has its own Patriarch (Pope) or Bishop. The role of each Patriarch or Bishop in Orthodox Churches is to make sure that the faith and doctrines that were handed down by the Apostles are preserved unchanged. You will see for example in Acts it mentions, “And they continued steadfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, in the breaking of bread, and in prayers.” (Acts 2: 42 New King James Version)

Things that are practiced in the Coptic Orthodox Church are handed down from the Apostles, we call them “Oral Traditions”. Before the bible was ever written, correct beliefs and worship was passed down orally. So the correct context of a particular verse from the bible comes from understanding what the Early Church fathers taught. St. Paul says, “Therefore, brethren, stand fast and hold the traditions which you were taught, whether by word or our epistle.” ( 2 Thessalonians 2:15 NKJV)

Before 451 AD (5th Century), all the Churches whether in Rome, Greece, Turkey, India, Ethiopia, or Egypt had the one doctrine and taught exactly the same thing despite the fact that they were separated by land, culture and distance. This tells you something very powerful. It tells you whatever that was practiced in the first 5 Centuries was correctly preserved unchanged from the Apostolic Teachings. So when you look at the type of worship that was practiced in the first 5 centuries, you will see that the style of worship is a liturgical worship. Liturgical prayers are focused on the Eucharist, which is the body and blood of Jesus.

There is a major difference between personal prayers and Church worship. In personal prayers, the Holy Spirit communicates spiritually on one to one basis. In Liturgical prayers, the purpose is for the Holy Spirit to turn the bread and wine into the body and blood of Jesus, so that all people may be renewed from inside out and connected to Jesus in an intimate level: physically, spiritually and mentally. Jesus refers to the mystery of the Eucharist in Matthew 26, “And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, blessed and broke it, and gave it to the disciples and said, "Take, eat; this is My body." Then He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you. For this is My blood of the new covenant, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.” (Matthew 26: 26-28)

The Key words here is, after Jesus blessed the bread and wine, the bread and wine became his body and blood. Equally in the Devine Liturgy, the priest invokes the Holy Spirit through Liturgical prayers which makes the bread become literally the Lord’s flesh and body.

You also see Jesus talking to the Jews about this in John 6:

“The Jews therefore quarrelled among themselves, saying, "How can this Man give us His flesh to eat?" Then Jesus said to them, "Most assuredly, I say to you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats My flesh and drinks My blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For My flesh is food indeed, and My blood is drink indeed. He who eats My flesh and drinks My blood abides in Me, and I in him. (John 6: 52-56)

So in the Eucharist or Holy Communion, we touch Jesus physically in a very intimate and personal way, which is much deeper than our personal prayers or personal interpretation of a verse.

The Devine Liturgy prayed on Sunday in the Coptic Orthodox Church comes from St. Basil the Great in the 4th Century. That is why it is called St. Basil Liturgy. St. Basil is one of the Early Church Fathers and the prayer format that was handed down by St. Basil was not changed throughout all these centuries and remains the same since the 4th Century. So why is it important to practice what was handed down by the Early Church Fathers? Because, the early Church Fathers were closer in time to the Apostolic Era and have an accurate understanding of the scriptures than say someone in the 20th or 21st Century trying to interpret the bible according to their own philosophy of life.

To understand more about Liturgical prayers, in particularly St. Basil Liturgy, I have posted detailed explanation under the thread called, “Explaining the St. Basil Liturgy”.

There is so much to explain to you, but I don’t want to overwhelm you with too much information in one go. I realise how difficult and different this must be all to you. I am more than happy to open up a new thread where we can go through each individual question you have step by step and to answer any queries you may have, or we can correspond through private messages.

Love and blessings
erini :)

[Shirija]

Hey, just to let you know, I tried searching for the tool to create a new thread but didn't find it. Where is it? Anyway, I don't know how to PM someone, either, on this particular forum. I can't find the tools :confused: But if you want to start another thread or whatever, that's totally cool w/ me. Another question that I have concerns worship: in my background, everything is really laid back and people just enter into worship whole heartedly. If you were to visit my church, you'd see people dancing, lifting up their hands, waving flags and banners and speaking in tounges. Then as worship progresses, it becomes less of a celebrations in so much as the mood shifts to one of deep reverance and awe (but still uplifted hands and speaking in tounges). So when I went to the Coptic service, I didn't understand it. I'm so accustomed to a spontaneous setting; but it's not like that in a Coptic setting (as far as my limited experiance call tell). So what is worship like for you? How does it work? Is the heart still in the same place, only it's manifested differently? Thanks.

peace and love

Shirija :help:

[domi]

Hey, just to let you know, I tried searching for the tool to create a new thread but didn't find it. Where is it?

I don't know where the exact button is but if u go to the bottom of coptic orthodox fourms it will say create quick thread..u can use that one.

Anyway, I don't know how to PM someone, either, on this particular forum. I can't find the tools :confused: But if you want to start another thread or whatever, that's totally cool w/ me.

That's easy. Click on the person's name..like Erini's for example, and it will take u to their profile, then there will be a little orange button there and it says send privite message, and u can use that :)

Another question that I have concerns worship: in my background, everything is really laid back and people just enter into worship whole heartedly. If you were to visit my church, you'd see people dancing, lifting up their hands, waving flags and banners and speaking in tounges. Then as worship progresses, it becomes less of a celebrations in so much as the mood shifts to one of deep reverance and awe (but still uplifted hands and speaking in tounges). So when I went to the Coptic service, I didn't understand it. I'm so accustomed to a spontaneous setting; but it's not like that in a Coptic setting (as far as my limited experiance call tell). So what is worship like for you? How does it work? Is the heart still in the same place, only it's manifested differently? Thanks.

Ernini exampled that on the st.basil dude fourm and it's realy cool and relay intersting. I liked it. You should defitnalty read it. That way u can save Erini from explainig it all over again..that way it will take her less time to get to my bible quetions looking for answers poast lol :P j/k it's fine. But u should read it though.

As for the big jumping up and holding up sings worship thing they don't do that in a coptic church b cuz it's consitered to be disrepectfull to god or something i'm not quite sure hany told me it once. When your praying to god u should be relaxed and calm and try to keep ur mind open to just god. I guss when ur jumping up and down like that it keeps ur mind open to other things. As for speaking in tonungs...ah...that kinda scares me..lol.

peace and love

Shirija :help:

I hope this helps

-Domi:yum:

[Yeznik]

Hey, just to let you know, I tried searching for the tool to create a new thread but didn't find it. Where is it? Anyway, I don't know how to PM someone, either, on this particular forum. I can't find the tools :confused: But if you want to start another thread or whatever, that's totally cool w/ me. Another question that I have concerns worship: in my background, everything is really laid back and people just enter into worship whole heartedly. If you were to visit my church, you'd see people dancing, lifting up their hands, waving flags and banners and speaking in tounges. Then as worship progresses, it becomes less of a celebrations in so much as the mood shifts to one of deep reverance and awe (but still uplifted hands and speaking in tounges). So when I went to the Coptic service, I didn't understand it. I'm so accustomed to a spontaneous setting; but it's not like that in a Coptic setting (as far as my limited experiance call tell). So what is worship like for you? How does it work? Is the heart still in the same place, only it's manifested differently? Thanks.

peace and love

Shirija :help:


There is a great degree of difference in going to church, and attending the Divine Liturgy on Sunday. The way it works is the way it has worked for the last 2000 years in regards to the Divine Liturgy. That doesn't mean people don't attend church during the week, attend bible study, sing church hymns, and pray together. Sunday is the day of our Lord and our Savior, and the celebration of the gift of Salvation, the is a special day set aside to praise God like the Apostles, Saints and our ancestors.

[Yeznik]

Welcome Shirija

[domi]

hey i should have said that.

Welcome to coptic forums Shirija

[erinipassi]

Hi Shirija,

I've opened a new thread for you called, "Coptic Orthodox Journey- Questions and Answers" and in it is a detailed answer to your question. Please visit the thread to know more about Coptic Orthodoxy and feel free to ask more questions in the new thread.

love and blessings
erini :thumbsup:

[feo]

bump!

[PhilopateerMercurios]

Hey all, I am actually in the process of converting to Coptic Orthodoxy. I love the Church. I pray at St. Antony the Great Coptic Orthodox Church under Abouna Antonios Girgis in San Antonio, Texas. I just wanted to say hi and that there are converts. The Coptic Church, having only had about thirty years in the US, is just starting to pick up momentum.

[CopticGirl]

Hey all, I am actually in the process of converting to Coptic Orthodoxy. I love the Church. I pray at St. Antony the Great Coptic Orthodox Church under Abouna Antonios Girgis in San Antonio, Texas. I just wanted to say hi and that there are converts. The Coptic Church, having only had about thirty years in the US, is just starting to pick up momentum.

We are happy to have you here! St. Mercurios/Philopateer/Abu Seifen is one of my favorite saints.

When I was a child and my mother was sick, she passed away on the same day that St. Mercurious was martyred (December 4th). After her passing, when we were cleaning out her purse, we found several pictures of him in there. We were unaware that my mother even knew about St. Mercurious, let alone kept more than one picture of him with her! So, he's one Saint that I will never forget.

Anyways, welcome! If you felt comfortable sharing, I would love to here what led you to our blessed church.

God Bless,
Elizabeth

[PhilopateerMercurios]

CopticGirl, This is a short testimony that I posted at CopticHymns.net:

Well, I was raised non-religious. My Grandparents would take us to church, because they were strict Southern Baptists. However, we never believed in much, because my parents didn't believe in much and they taught us to be critical of everything.

When I was about fifteen, I began feeling a longing for God. Someone, I only knew vaguely about and only vaguely believed in. I was a functional agnostic. I began to look into Orthodoxy, but issues in my life kept me from listening to God.

I was more interested in giving into my lusts and living my own way than follow God. Eventually, I embraced atheism as well as my perverse lusts. I came out as a gay person and was the most miserable person in the world. It was when I hit rock bottom. I had broken up with my "boyfriend" and I was having a hard time.

I began to seek God and remembered the Orthodox Church that I had read about. God, who is faithful and true, led me down a road which led me to the Coptic Church. I have been attending for a few months, and God has dealt with me on my sins. I am going to talk to Abouna about becoming a member of the Church so that I can participate in the Sacramental life of the Church which, I know, I need so badly.

That is my story in a nutshell.

[Rilian]

PhilopateerMercurios, interesting story. How do you feel you have been received at your church (I'm assuming you're a non-Copt by birth)?

Just curious.

[Xpycoctomos]

CopticGirl, This is a short testimony that I posted at CopticHymns.net:

Well, I was raised non-religious. My Grandparents would take us to church, because they were strict Southern Baptists. However, we never believed in much, because my parents didn't believe in much and they taught us to be critical of everything.

When I was about fifteen, I began feeling a longing for God. Someone, I only knew vaguely about and only vaguely believed in. I was a functional agnostic. I began to look into Orthodoxy, but issues in my life kept me from listening to God.

I was more interested in giving into my lusts and living my own way than follow God. Eventually, I embraced atheism as well as my perverse lusts. I came out as a gay person and was the most miserable person in the world. It was when I hit rock bottom. I had broken up with my "boyfriend" and I was having a hard time.

I began to seek God and remembered the Orthodox Church that I had read about. God, who is faithful and true, led me down a road which led me to the Coptic Church. I have been attending for a few months, and God has dealt with me on my sins. I am going to talk to Abouna about becoming a member of the Church so that I can participate in the Sacramental life of the Church which, I know, I need so badly.

That is my story in a nutshell.

THat's quite a story. Im so happy for you. God just doesn't give up, does He?

[PhilopateerMercurios]

The "Copts by birth" have been very open and friendly. When I told them I wanted to convert to the Coptic Orthodox Church, they were very happy and wanted to help with any questions I had. They also told me that if I wanted to be a part of their Church, I needed to learn how to enjoy food like an Egyptian. The people have been great and Abouna is wonderful.

[Franze]

I haven´t gone neither Egypt nor US for knowing copts, but It´s one of the most beautiful churches that I have seen, in the first place, the great courage to defend his faith against muslims, it´s impressive, you have a deep faith, guys, and this is wonderful. In addition the beauty of churches is impressive.
Like a catholic I would like an union and we need a true freedom religion in Egypt and other countries.
Greetings to everybody.

[NOTW]

Was everyone here born Coptic, or did they convert?
Hey there,
I was 'baptized' Coptic, of course, since I was born in Egypt where the majority are coptic/orthodox...
But to be honest, and no offense to any coptic, I don't like the strictness of the Coptics.
Thus I don't consider myself under any specific denomination.:wave:
And thus I'm considered an apostate in the eyes of the Coptic Fathers :cry:

[Michael the Iconographer]

You are right. Please forgive me if in the past I have said anything to offend my fellow Coptic or Oriental bretheren.

Hi John

Although I know it’s not your intention to be offensive, some of the comments you made I find are highly offensive and insensitive. When a person wants to get to know an Orthodox Church, any Orthodox person should not discourage them from getting to know Orthodoxy. If a person was trying to know the Eastern Orthodox Church, you would not venture to tell them in an Eastern Orthodox Forum, “I think you are doing good in being cautious at the moment to say that you are not definitely converting but jsut taht you are comfortable. This is good for now. Who knows where it will lead you...”.



This statement is not only offensive, but you are telling those who are wanting to know Coptic Orthodoxy that Coptic Orthodox do not have the fullness of Faith and it isn’t Orthodox. You have the right to believe whatever you like John and you have the right and freedom to think whatever you choose, but you do not have the right to come in to a Coptic Orthodox Forum and caution people against the Coptic Orthodox Church.



How insulting it would be if I went to the Eastern Orthodox Forums and told people indirectly who are interested in Eastern Orthodox that Eastern Orthodox does not have the Fullness of Faith and “who knows where God may lead you next”. Meaning that Eastern Orthodox may not be their final stop since it does not have the fullness of faith. What would you feel if someone did that in an Eastern Orthodox Forum???



Your message is indirectly saying since you view the Coptic Orthodox Church as heretical in obedience to your bishops, then people are best not to enter the Coptic Orthodox Church. You are in a Coptic Orthodox Forum, John. Just because we are gentle people, don’t try to take advantage of our kindness by throwing indirect insults. You are free to post your opinions in the Eastern Orthodox Forums and insult us to your heart’s content, but you have no right to insult us and discourage new comers who are interested in Coptic Orthodoxy in a Coptic Orthodox Forum.



If people are asking the Coptic and Oriental Orthodox People for particular answers in Coptic and Oriental Forum, then a non-Oriental Orthodox cannot answer on behalf of Coptic Orthodox about Coptic Orthodox theology or Church practice because it will be inaccurate. But non-Oriental Orthodox can answer these same questions from their own Church’s point of view. Example, if someone asks about baptism in a Coptic Orthodox forum, a person who is Eastern Orthodox can answer this question by saying, “In Eastern Orthodox teaching…”. An Eastern Orthodox cannot for example speak on behalf of the Coptic Orthodox teachings since they have not studied Coptic Orthodox sources.



Since we are not allowed to voice our opinion or clarify ourselves in an Eastern Orthodox Forum, the least an Eastern Orthodox can do when visiting the Coptic and Oriental Orthodox Forum, is to be respectful of our Church. Treat others the same way that you want your Church and yourself to be treated.



I am telling you all this because as I said to you before I am tired of seeing such judgemental attitudes towards the Coptic Orthodox Church. Isn’t it enough that we suffer so much persecution from Muslims and verbal persecution from protestants? How much more can people add to our suffering just because we are faithful to every word that is said in the first three Ecumenical Councils. Just because we are faithful to the third Ecumenical Councils teachings headed by St. Cyril and the terminology that was agreed on in the third Ecumenical Council that said, “One Incarnate Nature of God the Logos".

We bring our Coptic sufferings, our pain and tears to our Lord Jesus, and say with him on the Cross, “Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they do” (Luke 23: 34)



I ask for your forgiveness if I have offended you in any way, and to pray for me.



Love and blessings

erini

[Michael the Iconographer]

I am not Coptic or Oriental so I am not sure how much this matters to anyone here, but I was born Roman Catholic and then at the age 25 converted to Eastern Orthodoxy.

[Xpycoctomos]

I just want to explain that the Erini's post that was brought up by my Brother Micheal (with good intentions, because the points that Erini made were good) was a cause of misunderstandings and has long since been straightened out. I harbor no sentiment of distaste for the OOs or their Church and, as I have said ad nauseum, I am not convinced that the issues that separate us are actually divisive. Because of this, I would never feel comfortable in anyway discouraging a non-Christian or a protestant from becoming OO and in fact I would be very happy to here of such a conversion, as long as the convert truly understood and accepted what the Coptic Church means when they proclaim that they are the "One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church"... this is vital.

John

[minasoliman]

To echo John's words, I am glad for Michael to join the Orthodox Church. I am personally a big fan of Fr. Peter Gillquist who leads an Orthodox evangelism. He is truly an inspiration.

Dear NOTW,

Which church do you commune in, if you don't mind me asking?

God bless.

[Michael the Iconographer]

To echo John's words, I am glad for Michael to join the Orthodox Church. I am personally a big fan of Fr. Peter Gillquist who leads an Orthodox evangelism. He is truly an inspiration.

Dear NOTW,

Which church do you commune in, if you don't mind me asking?

God bless.

Minasoliman,
I am glad there is the presence of the Coptic and Oriental Orthodox Churches in the world. First of all your iconography is incredibly beautiful. Second while I have not yet been to a Coptic liturgy it is my understanding that the piety and prayerfulness of the Coptic and Oriental Churches can put to shame that of the Eastern Orthodox Churches. I am not really sure that what divides us really divides us and thus I pray that a true union between our two churches will one day be reached. May God bless you all.
Michael

[Photini]

I love Coptic Icons! :clap:

I also have a soft spot in my heart for the Ethiopian church. My sister's parish shares a building with a small group of Ethiopians who need a place to worship. They've even incoporated a couple of the traditions into their Liturgy....like the umbrella.

[therighteousjosh]

what is this "Coptic"?

[Xpycoctomos]

In my User CP it shows Joshtherighteous as having posted something. And then I come here and I can't find it. Why is that?

[feo]

its tricky~!

[Xpycoctomos]

ahhh... hey feo, how's it going? Did you ever think this thread of yours would live on this long? ;)

[feo]

ahhh... hey feo, how's it going? Did you ever think this thread of yours would live on this long? ;)

Pretty good :wave: how about yourself, how you doing? I'm actually glad this thread has been goin on for as long as it has... I've been wanting to join an orthodox Church for awhile; and I'm really digging the Coptic one nearby :angel: