an Orthodox confession

[trooper]

I have just read sin_vladimirov's discussion on the papacy and I found it brilliant. It led me to think about how much about EO'xy I find to be right; in fact, I attended an EO Church for a time and although I can't think of one thing that I disagree with them about, I just couldn't kosher to the liturgy. I think that I found it to be too.. Eastern. I am concerned in my heart that I would reject a faith because it just didn't fit me, culturally. Does anyone think that we could all come together if it weren't for the cultural differences? and if so, how wrong is that? I am still ECUSA because I just can't get enough of the Prayer Book, but I'm not sure that I am thinking the right way. Any thoughts?

[Konstantinos]

There are EO churches which use the western (latin) liturgy the western orthodox church.

[masuwerte]

Does anyone think that we could all come together if it weren't for the cultural differences?

The differences aren't all cultural. I don't think the Orthodox would want to be in communion with us as long as we ordain women, for example. And I wouldn't want to give that up.

[Aymn27]

I have just read sin_vladimirov's discussion on the papacy and I found it brilliant. It led me to think about how much about EO'xy I find to be right; in fact, I attended an EO Church for a time and although I can't think of one thing that I disagree with them about, I just couldn't kosher to the liturgy. I think that I found it to be too.. Eastern. I am concerned in my heart that I would reject a faith because it just didn't fit me, culturally. Does anyone think that we could all come together if it weren't for the cultural differences? and if so, how wrong is that? I am still ECUSA because I just can't get enough of the Prayer Book, but I'm not sure that I am thinking the right way. Any thoughts?
trooper...there's a thread over in the Orthodox forum that addresses Anglicanism. There are some links to articles by Bp. Ware, etc on how close Anglicanism and the EO came to unity in the 20s-30s. It is very interesting. I think the problem came in where they viewed some parts of Anglicanism as being too Protestant, and eventually - the movment lost momentum. Now, it is highly unlikely that the broader communion would ever be accepted b/c of women's ordination and the whole ECUSA/ACiC situation - though I could see a conservative Anglo-Catholic portion being accepted back. I agree, though, I love there liturgies, but it just isn't "me"...

Blessings,
Aaron

[trooper]

Thanks so much for your thoughts. I have read Bp. Ware's basic intro to EO and I loved it. I don't want to alienate my friends here but I am one of those ACs who are opposed to women's ordination and I know that I am not the only one. Is there any talk of certain factions within Anglicanism of joining with the EO and if not, why not...

Esp. thanks for the info on the Western rite within EO. I doubt that this is happening in my small corner of the world, but it does give one hope!

My prayers for you all,

[Colabomb]

I have just read sin_vladimirov's discussion on the papacy and I found it brilliant. It led me to think about how much about EO'xy I find to be right; in fact, I attended an EO Church for a time and although I can't think of one thing that I disagree with them about, I just couldn't kosher to the liturgy. I think that I found it to be too.. Eastern. I am concerned in my heart that I would reject a faith because it just didn't fit me, culturally. Does anyone think that we could all come together if it weren't for the cultural differences? and if so, how wrong is that? I am still ECUSA because I just can't get enough of the Prayer Book, but I'm not sure that I am thinking the right way. Any thoughts?
We continuing Churches are more likely to come into Communion with Eastern Orthodoxy than Ecusa is.

The Ordination of Women, and the acceptance of homosexuality are huge barriers to any ECUSA/EO Communion.

[SirTimothy]

Personally, I think the ECCatG and the Greek Orthodox could come into communion with no difficulties. We don't ordain women priests--although we do allow them to become deacons.

Timothy

[Colabomb]

Personally, I think the ECCatG and the Greek Orthodox could come into communion with no difficulties. We don't ordain women priests--although we do allow them to become deacons.

Timothy
Deacons? Or Deaconesses? There is a difference.

Do they recieve Holy orders? Or is it a lay ministry?

[SirTimothy]

The recieve Holy Orders... as the Council of... I think it was Chalcedon allows? There was a limit imposed then of 40, but that shouldn't be a problem... at least in this diocese. :)

Timothy

[Rilian]

-

[Simon_Templar]

One of the problems I ran into when considering eastern orthodox was the extreme rigidness when it came to considering other churches for communion.

Let me state by saying that I agree with probably 90% maybe even more of eastern orthodox doctrine, including not ordaining women etc..

The only real diffences I have with eastern orthodox are primarily in form and freedom of worship. I come from a non liturgical church background, and although I want to partake in a liturgical service, I also want the freedom to have a service which is reflective of my culture, and my tradition (meaning the traditions with which I was raised). This (even if i were to agree 100% with all other EO doctrinal positions) is enough for many, seemingly most, EO to disfellowship me. In my view this fact is indicative of a grave problem within their church.

It has been mentioned that there is western-rite orthodoxy, and this is true, however, even in the case of western-rite orthodoxy there are many within the EO church that see this allowance as a bad thing and they view the western-rite as the result of the EO church leadership being too interested in the ecumenical movement and basicly too willing to sacrifice the purity of the EO church to bring in westerners.

In some ways it seems that the EO have almost made ethnicity a part of their core doctrine.


I was very saddened to find this kind of inflexability on things so tangential to the core truths of the faith because I really wanted to have a positive relationship with the EO church.


PS on a side note, I attended a local ECUSA, Forward in Faith, Parish today and was very excited about it. I'm not going to rush into it, but if everything works out I hope to become a member there.

[trooper]

One of the problems I ran into when considering eastern orthodox was the extreme rigidness when it came to considering other churches for communion.

Let me state by saying that I agree with probably 90% maybe even more of eastern orthodox doctrine, including not ordaining women etc..

The only real diffences I have with eastern orthodox are primarily in form and freedom of worship. I come from a non liturgical church background, and although I want to partake in a liturgical service, I also want the freedom to have a service which is reflective of my culture, and my tradition (meaning the traditions with which I was raised). This (even if i were to agree 100% with all other EO doctrinal positions) is enough for many, seemingly most, EO to disfellowship me. In my view this fact is indicative of a grave problem within their church.

It has been mentioned that there is western-rite orthodoxy, and this is true, however, even in the case of western-rite orthodoxy there are many within the EO church that see this allowance as a bad thing and they view the western-rite as the result of the EO church leadership being too interested in the ecumenical movement and basicly too willing to sacrifice the purity of the EO church to bring in westerners.

In some ways it seems that the EO have almost made ethnicity a part of their core doctrine.


I was very saddened to find this kind of inflexability on things so tangential to the core truths of the faith because I really wanted to have a positive relationship with the EO church.


PS on a side note, I attended a local ECUSA, Forward in Faith, Parish today and was very excited about it. I'm not going to rush into it, but if everything works out I hope to become a member there.

Ditto on what I found on my EO visits. The Greeks weren't too fond of the fact that I wasn't Greek and the Russians weren't too fond of the fact that I wasn't Russian, etc, etc. etc. Still trying to figure out where I stand.

I am immensely jealous that you have a FiF parish near you. I hope that you find this to be your home and that the Church will grow.:pray:
Pax!

[gtsecc]

As long as the East and West are split, there is nothing wrong with being Anglican.

[Colabomb]

Ditto on what I found on my EO visits. The Greeks weren't too fond of the fact that I wasn't Greek and the Russians weren't too fond of the fact that I wasn't Russian, etc, etc. etc. Still trying to figure out where I stand.

I am immensely jealous that you have a FiF parish near you. I hope that you find this to be your home and that the Church will grow.:pray:
Pax!
I'll stick with the Orthodox English Catholic Church.

Fits me ;)

[Colabomb]

The recieve Holy Orders... as the Council of... I think it was Chalcedon allows? There was a limit imposed then of 40, but that shouldn't be a problem... at least in this diocese. :)

Timothy
Granted I only glanced at it, but where does the council of Chalcedon mention deaconesses recieving Holy Orders?

[SirTimothy]

No woman under 40 years of age is to be ordained a deacon, and then only after close scrutiny.

And incidentally, the word for Ordained is the same that is used for Male Deacons and Priests. :)

Timothy

[Slammer]

Amen to that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!