About the Salvation Army

[Sojourner<><]

Is it affilliated with any particular denomination or is it actually a denomination in itself? :confused:

[something from the fridge]

i think it is a denomination in itself. comes under the christian church banner and if you want to get really technical, it is catholic, but then most christian churches are catholic and it is just a word used to class churches!!!

i think william booth (the founder) was a methodist.

[Evangelina]

Hi Sojourner,
Have a look at the Resources sticky (http://www.christianforums.com/t1199860-online-resources-sa-and-other.html) for some links to answers to some of the standard Salvation Army questions. I just added some!

[tadpole29]

Although we are considered, atleast in the states, to be non-denominational, most salvos will tell you they are salvationist.

[Evangelina]

Well we are pretty much a 'denomination by default' in many ways... most salvos, I'd think, would only attend a SA church, go to a SA bible study group, etc.

[Andy Broadley]

The Army describes itself as a Christian Church, part of the worldwide evangelical Christian Church. We are in no way non-demoninational.

We are a denomination in our own right, independant of all and any other denomination, not by default, but by design.

Various Acts of Parliament have pertained to the Army, I believe the most recent being the Salvation Army Act 1980.

[Evangelina]

Hmmm... I don't think the SA is officially a denomination in Australia. Or if so, it's quite recent.

Andy - am I wrong in my impression that the Booths did not intend to start a denomination, but a inter-denominational movement?

[Andy Broadley]

My understanding is that the Army is a denomination in it's own right as a worldwide movement, not on a country to country basis.


As for the origional intentions of the Booth's, I would need to do more research in order to accurately answer this. It would seem reasonable to assume that it's status did indeed change as it grew in it's early years, but could almost certainly have been classed as a denomination by the time Bramwell objected to being called a volunteer, and the Salavtion Army came into being.

I'm off for a few days now, but I'll come back to this one again and we can look at it in detail, as I believe it is an important question that needs an accurate answer

[Evangelina]

I'm off for a few days now, but I'll come back to this one again and we can look at it in detail, as I believe it is an important question that needs an accurate answer

Thanks Andy :)

[something from the fridge]

Well we are pretty much a 'denomination by default' in many ways... most salvos, I'd think, would only attend a SA church, go to a SA bible study group, etc.

nope. i go to salvo church (am a soldier at darwin corps) if there is one there. if not i'll go to another church.

also, i don' go to a SA bible study, there is no group in the corps that i would feel comfortable. i'm currently looking for another bible study, preferably through the uni or an interdenominational group to join.

[Evangelina]

nope. i go to salvo church (am a soldier at darwin corps) if there is one there. if not i'll go to another church.

also, i don' go to a SA bible study, there is no group in the corps that i would feel comfortable. i'm currently looking for another bible study, preferably through the uni or an interdenominational group to join.

Well, I did say 'most', not 'all'! :) What I meant was, salvos will go to a salvo church by preference... which is similar to people of other denominations. Sorry, my wording WAS dodgy.

Hmmm... Andy, this is pretty much what I was getting at in the question about intentions for denomination vs movement by the Booths -

His original aim was to send converts to established churches of the day, but soon he realized that the poor did not feel comfortable or welcome in the pews of most of the churches and chapels of Victorian England. Regular churchgoers were appalled when these shabbily dressed, unwashed people came to join them in worship.

Booth decided to found a church especially for them — the East London Christian Mission. The mission grew slowly, but Booth's faith in God remained undiminished.
Salvation Army History (http://www1.salvationarmy.org/ihq/www_sa.nsf/vw-dynamic-arrays/5622F771BD70A75A80256D4E003AE0A3?openDocument)

[Andy Broadley]

Just a quick look in to update you all on progress. Had long discussion with CO while cowering in the kitchen during JAM club on Monday!! (cowardice in the face of the enamy - they used to shoot you for that:D )

First I can catagorically confirm that the Salvation Army is a denomination in it's own right, on an equal par with any other (Methodists, Elim Pentecostals, Quakers etc etc.). Not only that, but as we are a world wide Army, our status as a denomination is the same regardless of the country. So we are much a denomination in the States & Aussie as we are in Britain.

The problem would appear to be simply one of perception, not only other peoples perception of the Army, but also our own perception of ourselves.

Clearly the Army differs from country to country, but certain things are set in stone. Although we are probably better known as a Christian Charitable organisation, we are first and formost a denomination of the Christian CHURCH.

Army letter headed paper in this country carries the caption "The Salvation Army - A Christian Church and a registered charity - with heart to God and hand to man"

So, that we are indeed a denomination is indesputable. This led to the second part of the question. Having established our status as a denomination, when did we bocome one?

As ITF has pointed out, General Booth's origional intention was to 'feed' his converts into the established churches. However, it quickly became apparent that this was unworkable because the churches would not accept the people that Booth was attracting to his meetings.

So, when did we become a denomination, a Church, in our own right? I'm still looking at this but I have narrowed it down to two possible years. The first corps was Poplar in East London, which opened in 1867 (their website states that they are 138 years old), some 11 years before the Christian Mission became the Salvation Army. That would appear to have a good claim to the honour.

However, I have also found a reference to the name change in 1878, which states that the Army became a legal entity at that time. What this entity entailed is, as yet, unclear. Certainly, through the years, the Army has been subject to several Acts of Parliament, the most recent being The Salvation Army Act 1980 (I believe).

Anyway, thats the situation to date. I'll keep digging and let you know what I find. Remember I said this was a quick update? Well in that case the full version should be a good cure for insomnia!!:D :D

[Sojourner<><]

That was very informative! :thumbsup:

I was curious because I'm looking for ways to be more active as a Christian without having to join a different church that has more programs. I really want to get out into the world with other Christians without having to fully devote myself to a mission (for the moment at least). I guess I was hoping that the Salvation Army might be the kind of organization that I'm looking for, but since it's a denomination in itself would that even be possible? I mean, I've never met a Christian who is say a methodist and an adventist at the same time.

[Andy Broadley]

Yea, no problem. The debate here has been about our staues as a demonination. That does not mean you have to sign on the dotted line for life and don't you dare ever go anywhere else:D .

The thing to remember is that you are first and foremost a Christian, and your choice of church is very very much secondary to that. If you feel that you can be at your most effective spiritually by 'mixing and matching' churches, then go for it.

And if anyone you meet has a problem with that then they can talk to Jesus about it on Judgement day!!:thumbsup:

[Warren Peace]

Is it affilliated with any particular denomination or is it actually a denomination in itself? :confused:The Salvation Army is a denomination of its own, with a destinct doctrine. William and Catherine Booth were members of the Methodist church before they created the Salvation Army. While there are similarities between the Methodist and Salvation Army churches in their Wesleyan heritage, there are also destinct differences.

I was at a Methodist church last year in Pilon, Cuba, and was very happy to see that they have a songbook much like the Salvation Army's... although their's was written in Spanish.

The following is a good article outlining the similarites and differences between the Salvation Army and the Methodist churches: http://www.christiantoday.com/news/church/348.htm

Blessings...

[Evangelina]

That was very informative! :thumbsup:

I was curious because I'm looking for ways to be more active as a Christian without having to join a different church that has more programs. I really want to get out into the world with other Christians without having to fully devote myself to a mission (for the moment at least). I guess I was hoping that the Salvation Army might be the kind of organization that I'm looking for, but since it's a denomination in itself would that even be possible? I mean, I've never met a Christian who is say a methodist and an adventist at the same time.

To become a member of the SA, you make quite a time commitment. Some corps won't allow non-members to be involved in positions of leadership (eg. teaching sunday school, leading youth group). Some do - possibly out of desperation. That said, the 'church' and 'charity' sections of the SA are somewhat separated in Australia at least... I know it's entirely possible to volunteer at the local Salvo Family Store or the youth shelter without being a member of the Salvation Army. For that matter being a christian is often optional too. :scratch:

It really depends, I guess, on what you're wanting to do, too. It might work better for you to seek out an interdenominational group (like Worldwide Evangelism for Christ) and get involved with their activities. Or the Salvos might be a good match for you.

Hmmm.. did that help or confuse?

[Andy Broadley]

Still chasing the 'legal' bit, I'll keep you posted. I know it doesn't actually matter as sunch, but I'm curious and I like Army history.

[Delta One]

Hi something from the fridge,

i think it is a denomination in itself. comes under the christian church banner and if you want to get really technical, it is catholic, but then most christian churches are catholic and it is just a word used to class churches!!!

The Salvation Army is not technically a part of the Catholic church. You have two distinct groups of Christians: the Catholics and the Protestants. We would be under the Protestant classification as we do not share the same beliefs with almost everything about the Catholics, e.g. the role of Mary, women being ministers (we allow and encourage it), contraception (once again, we allow it), and the whole list goes on. The main thing is that we both believe in the Bible and who and what Jesus was and did for us. I for one believe that Mary is just an ordinary dead woman who is still rotting in her grave, while Catholics disagree with this. As far as I know, there is no Biblical basis for believing that Mary should be held up high. She may have been special for God to have Jesus be born to her, but other than that, she was just an ordinary sinful creature who is now long dead.

We all go under the banner of Christians (or followers of Jesus Christ).

Delta One.

[elm0]

catholic: adj. Including or concerning all humankind; universal.

Catholic: adj.
a. Of or involving the Roman Catholic Church.
b. Of or relating to the universal Christian church.
c. Of or relating to the ancient undivided Christian church.
d. Of or relating to those churches that have claimed to be representatives of the ancient undivided church.

Catholic: n. A member of a Catholic church, especially a Roman Catholic.

Straight from the dictionary, catholic does have more than one meaning.

[Cool CD]

Being willing to go to a church that is not affiliated with The Salvation Army may make you interdenominationally minded, but it doesn't make The Salvation Army as a whole that way. Actually though The Salvation Army is very open, because they serve needy that eventually go to a variety of different churches when they settle down with God's grace. Also, they have thousands of employees who are not Salvationists. I have worked for The Salvation Army in the past in responsible positions but never had to join the church. I am a Christian and that's what mattered, along with the fact that my morals are consistent with them (i.e. I don't drink alcohol).

nope. i go to salvo church (am a soldier at darwin corps) if there is one there. if not i'll go to another church.

also, i don' go to a SA bible study, there is no group in the corps that i would feel comfortable. i'm currently looking for another bible study, preferably through the uni or an interdenominational group to join.

[Warren Peace]

comes under the christian church banner and if you want to get really technical, it is catholic...Sorry, I didn't notice this error until now. The Salvation Army is by no means a Catholic church. We are Protestant. Your statement leads me to believe that you have never been to a Catholic church before, or you would see the differences pretty easily.
... but then most christian churches are catholic and it is just a word used to class churches!!!You should look up what Protestantism means before you answer anymore questions ;)
i think william booth (the founder) was a methodist.Yes, finally, a correct statement!

Blessings...

[elm0]

Warren, this has already been queried, here's the dictionary definitions I posted previously:



catholic: adj. Including or concerning all humankind; universal.

Catholic: adj.
a. Of or involving the Roman Catholic Church.
b. Of or relating to the universal Christian church.
c. Of or relating to the ancient undivided Christian church.
d. Of or relating to those churches that have claimed to be representatives of the ancient undivided church.

Catholic: n. A member of a Catholic church, especially a Roman Catholic.

Straight from the dictionary, catholic does have more than one meaning.

[Warren Peace]

Oops... guess I should have scanned the whole thread before responding... sawwy :sorry:

[Andy Broadley]

Being totally pedantic here (sorry), but just for the sake of accuracy, William and Catherine Booth were members of the Methodist New Connexion prior to forming the East London Christian Mission.

Gee, I really hate people like me......

[Warren Peace]

Gee, I really hate people like me......So do we, Andy, so do we ;)

[Andy Broadley]

So do we, Andy, so do we ;)

:) lol

[elm0]

Pedantism is a curse, I try very hard not to let it take control.

[Andy Broadley]

Pedantism is a curse, I try very hard not to let it take control.

Theres a thread devoted to it somewhere...

[elm0]

Theres a thread devoted to it somewhere...

There's always a thread, no matter what the topic.

[Warren Peace]

Pedantism is a curse, I try very hard not to let it take control.Would it be overly pedantic for me to correct that statement?

Oh forget it, I'm too :holy: for that.

:amen: