The "pope"

[Songspinner]

Why is it that we don't recognise the bisop of Rome as Pope?

(incidentally he was refered to as "the catholics chief sheppard" on sunday at my church thought that was very poetic

[PaladinValer]

Because we are not Vatican Catholics but English Catholics. That's the short answer.

The long answer involves complex politics, blood and gore, death, corruption...hmmm...I think we got the makings of a blockbuster movie! ^_^

It was mainly political. The papacy was sacked by a powerful and rich family and Henry VIII needed an annulment. He couldn't get it because the family told the pope to decline, and so he proclaimed himself head of the Church in England. This is still a short answer, and quite generalized, but I simply do not have the strength currently to write a 10 paper (it could easily be that).

[Jamme]

Is the Queen of England the head of the worldwide Anglican church, or just the Church-of-England?

[pmcleanj]

Here's another answer. But first

I enjoin everyone, to show great sensitivity and compassion for the next week or two, when dealing with any issue refering to the Patriarch of the Roman Catholic church. Many of our Roman Catholic brothers and sisters are deeply grieved at the passing of John Paul II. Please avoid any comments that might in any way contribute to deepening their distress.
End of Mod-hat

"Pope" derives from "Papa", and that is what it means. Every Bishop is in fact a father to the Christians in his diocese, for whom he is directly accountable to Christ. We affirm the principal of autocephalism, and deny that any hierarchy exists among bishops. Even though Primates and Archbishops exercise administrative authority within their sees, they do not dictate dogma to other bishops, but act as "first among equals" within their see. In the same way, the Archbishop of Canterbury is "first among equals" within the Anglican Communion, and the Bishop of Rome is "first among equals" among the whole community of Bishops.

To that degree, Anglicans do indeed recognize the primacy of the Bishop of Rome. It is an undeniable part of the Church's Tradition. What we don't recognize, is that primacy conveys dogmatic authority. And because the term "Pope" is generally associated with that notion of episcopal hierarchy and dogmatic authority, we generally eschew the term.

[pmcleanj]

Is the Queen of England the head of the worldwide Anglican church, or just the Church-of-England?

Her Majesty the Queen is not the head of the church at all. It is a subtle distinction, but the wording of the Act of Supremacy is quite clear, and made moreso by the context of history.

Henry VIII passed an "Act of Supremacy" that declared the king to be "supreme head of the church". Edward VI did not alter this Act in any way.

Mary revoked the Act of Supremacy, and all other Acts relating to the practice of religion passed subsequently, including those passed under Edward VI.

Elizabeth I restored all the Acts Mary had revoked, except the Act of Supremacy. She passed her own Act of Supremacy that declared the monarch to be "supreme governor of the realm" and which clarifies that this means that no other person, no foreign power, no prelate from another See, has the right to wield power over Britons, temporally or spiritual. As supreme governor of the realm Elizabeth II has authority over all legislation, including authority over the Church of England to the degree that it is established by law.

Although Elizabeth II is supreme governor and head-of-state of many other countries too, including my own, those countries do not have an establishment and therefore she has no authority over the Church in those Commonwealths. And of course, she has no authority over the Church in any republic.

[Iron Sun 254]

Not recognizing the primacy of the Pope means we're saying "We reserve the right to disagree." It doesn't mean we don't value what the Pope has to say.

[julian the apostate]

if i disagree with my father he is still my father

i still consider myself in communion with rome (they may have a different take)

but if it werent for God working through the ecusa i dont know where i would be

i have the best of both worlds

[Colabomb]

Roman Catholicism is a Living Branch of the One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church.

Peter, and the Bishops of Rome Following him, have always been in a sense, the first among equals. The Difference between the Roman Catholic, and the Anglican/Eastern Orthodox position on this is how we view the Phrase.

For Roman Catholics the phrase is "FIRST Amongst equals".

We Anglicans, and the Eastern Orthodox see it as "First amongst EQUALS".

[Albion]

Why is it that we don't recognise the bisop of Rome as Pope?

(incidentally he was refered to as "the catholics chief sheppard" on sunday at my church thought that was very poetic

We all, as Anglicans, recognize the bishop of Rome as the bishop of Rome. I think everyone is content to refer to him as "the Pope." In view of the historic prominence of that bishopric, many Anglicans would be willing to go so far as to acknowledge him also as "Patriarch of the West," a title he gained a long time ago from the Roman Empire. It's the universal authority over church matters that Catholics accept but we don't that is the issue.

[SirTimothy]

Mainly because I don't wish to offend/confuse my Coptic Orthodox brethren who also have their own Pope--in Egypt. :)

Timothy

[Bonifatius]

We all, as Anglicans, recognize the bishop of Rome as the bishop of Rome. I think everyone is content to refer to him as "the Pope." In view of the historic prominence of that bishopric, many Anglicans would be willing to go so far as to acknowledge him also as "Patriarch of the West," a title he gained a long time ago from the Roman Empire. It's the universal authority over church matters that Catholics accept but we don't that is the issue.


Hi Albion,

I totally agree. :wave:
Our priest spoke a good deal about "the pope" in his sermon last Sunday, and after the intercessions we had a special moment of silence to pray for the pope and the Roman-catholic Church in this time of transition. It was very good.

I think the life and death (!) of His Holiness Pope JPII were an outstanding testimony to the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ and brought many back to the church and the faith.

We do not recognize the pope as having jurisdiction over the Anglican churches, but we certainly can recognize him as one of the important christian leaders.

All the best
Tom