Peter and 'the rock'

[TomUK]

I was thinking earlier about Peter being the head of the church on the earth and all that, and was reminded of the quote in one of the gospels (i think it's matthew) where it says something like 'you Peter are my rock'. I seem to recall a couple of translations put in the footnotes that Peter means rock, but i was wondering how true that was. I admit that i don't know much about etymology, but is this is case of the chicken and the egg? Ie. does Peter mean rock, or does rock mean Peter? The same is true (perhaps more so) for some of the Old Testament names, particularly those in Genesis.

I'm not really sure what the point of all this is, but i think we often hear it quoted that Peter is the rock of the church yada yada but i was just wondering how much of this is due to convention rather than divine meaning.

(If i'm rambling then please ignore me! :) )

[gitlance]

In my understanding, "Peter" does indeed mean "rock." Though that passage in Matthew has two words for rock: one means big rock, one means little rock. I believe Peter's name means "little rock," whereas the rock on which Christ would build His Church means "big rock."

I'm probably wrong though.... :P

Christ's peace!

[PaladinValer]

Peter was the first first-among-equals, but he was no pope ;)

[RobNJ]

"you are Petros(specific rock or stone), and on this petra(stone mass, or bedrock)........"

[gtsecc]

Did Peter mean "rock" before the church? Or, did that meanign come about after the fact?

[TomUK]

Did Peter mean "rock" before the church? Or, did that meanign come about after the fact? That was what i meant. In other words, at the time of Christ did Peter's name mean rock, or is that a convention which we have established over the course of history?

[gtsecc]

That was what i meant. In other words, at the time of Christ did Peter's name mean rock, or is that a convention which we have established over the course of history?

Exactly!!

[RobNJ]

I take it as: The man Christ referred to as Simon Bar-Jona a verse or two earlier, was called Rock....and the term for rock has been transliterated as a name, ever since.
In other words...it meant rock, and has since grown into a common first name.

[Colabomb]

Jesus did not call Peter Peter like it was a name.

It was like saying.

"Hey Rock". Petros meant Rock, and we, (because Christ used it like a nickname) later made it into a proper name.

At least that is my understanding of it.

[julian the apostate]

ok,,
there is no word for pebble in greek or aramaic

only rock,, peter is the masculinized form of the greek and aramaic words which are feminine


is what i had learned during my days as a vat cat,,

[Victrixa]

Hello :wave:

May I just intrude in this thread?.... Do not worry, I am not here to debate. ;)

Just want to share something. :)

In the documents which I have been reading, I discovered that in the passage of Matthew 16:18, when Peter is mentioned, it does mean rock. Peter=Rock, Rock=Peter. This passage was written in Aramaic. Jesus and His apostles spoke Aramaic. In Aramaic, Kephas means Rock. When the passage was translated into Greek, two words, instead of one, were available to refer to Peter and the word Rock. Since Peter was a man (obviously), the word petros had to be used. 'You are Petros and on this Petra I will be build my Church.' Petros is masculine, petra is feminine. The translation couldn't have been "You are Petra and on this Petra I will build my church" because Peter was male and couldn't be given a female name in the Greek! lol Anyways, it was just a translation problem because in Aramaic, Rock is the same as Peter and vice-versa.

Okay, I'm gently bowing out..... :D

[PaladinValer]

St. Peter was the first first-among-equals. The idea of a pope the way you Vatican Catholics have it is foreign to Church history until you yourselves declared it in a council local to your church only; one that no one else recognizes.

St. Peter wasn't a pope, but was definitely a first-among-equals and, I believe, the very first one to hold that title.

[Victrixa]

Paladin,

Just wanted to let you know that this is not (what you shared to me in your post) what I have discovered in my study of Church History. In my studies, I have found out that I can no longer go against the evidence which I have discovered concerning the Primacy of Peter. (I have considered Lutheranism and Orthodoxy, ya know, but the Lord has (miraculously so) guided me back to and keeps guiding me in a deeper way into the Catholic Church. ;) )

Just wanted you to know that maybe we haven't read the same documentation?

With all my respect and in Christ's love,

Victrixa

[julian the apostate]

victrixia<<Petros is masculine, petra is feminine.


exactly!