Blood and Fire - What did that look like originally?

[rapturefish]

Blood and Fire - That is the Salvation Army motto, from what I've heard. Looking at the origins of the Salvation Army, what did that mean in the early life of the Army? Because I have the suspicion that the original Salvation Army was one characterized by both the work of Jesus' blood on the cross and the work of the Holy Spirit supernaturally as well. But when I think about the Salvos (what we also call them here in Oz) these days I perceive an organisation that runs charities and looks after the homeless and does still have church services, but I'm not necessarily sure they are more christian than charity organisation. And where is the fire today? Hope to have someone correct my limited perceptions.

blessings,

RF :D <><

[Abiel]

Your perception may be correct. Yes, it's the blood of Jesus and the fire of the holy spirit, but the social work has in some locations totally swamped the mission. It's a problem that the world wide army is aware of and is seeking to address in several ways. For example, youth ministry in the UK has been revamped with emphasis on discipleship, mission and social action. It's a bit like turning a huge steam ship, but it is happening. In Corps throughout the UK, we are seeking God like never before. We had a year of non-stop 24-7 prayer a couple of years ago, and I am convinced that we are entering a time of refreshing and renewal. I hope that is true in other parts of the world.

[elm0]

Yeah, the Salvos as a church here in Oz are starting to wake up. I haven't been involved in my corps very long (3 yrs) but I have seen some major changes happening. The fire is burning brighter than before, and we are seeing some awesome things happening. I see this from a youth leader's perspective, so to me it is seeming like the more our youth, who are mainly new Christians, become involved in the life of our corps, the more 'fired-up' our other members are becoming.

On the charity side, I was sad to find out that our local Salvation Army Youth Outreach Service had more non-Christian staff than it did Christian!! This is starting to change as the local Salvos realise that they should be more involved in their own projects.

[Abiel]

Blood and Fire - That is the Salvation Army motto, from what I've heard. Looking at the origins of the Salvation Army, what did that mean in the early life of the Army?<><


Sorry- I didnt answer this question. You could read some Army history- there are a few straight forward books out there. For me is was characterised by a can do attitude that knew no bounds. Go for souls, go for the worst was an early saying.
When the Army was set up in the USA, it was one salvationist family who emigrated and thought they would give it a try who did it- no premises, find an old warehouse. No experience, make it up as you go along. God's in this so lets do it! This kind of thing happened over and over- then the work got big, and the regulations of the law got stricter, and we had a good second world war, and then Salvationists, benefiting from a life lived in the gospel became increasingly respectable and nice and middle class...and so we have had a few years when the work has outweighed the mission- but it has always been there, and God is shaking us up!

[rapturefish]

I had the blessing of going to Papua New Guinea last year. A colleague of my pastor's is now the director of Port Moresby City Mission, a cousin of the then Sydney City Mission. It's supposed to be a christian organisation, but the Sydney mission has become welfare-centred and not Christ-centred. However, the director in PNG was adamant from the start that the PMCM had to be centred on the gospel or it wouldn't work. He takes in boys off the streets of Port Moresby, tells the gospel and converts them, gets them on a farm where they learn a trade, then set them up for casual work, then if all goes well it becomes full-time employment.

He sent three of his staff to Australia to a retreat and sadly the three boys learnt about the reality of the state of Sydney City Mission. The Sydney people want the director to gut out the gospel and focus on the welfare, but of course the director will have none of it. And because of that stance, the PMCM is growing and having a positive impact on the city.

It will be good to see that happen more and more with the Salvos. There are several organisations that started out christian but along the way became mere welfare or other things instead. May the Salvos not be like that, but realise that the gospel is the heart of what makes it alive and relevant to a dying world.

blessings,

RF :D <><

[Andy Broadley]

If I may quote General Booth on this subject, He said "It's no good telling a man who is hungry and has nothing on his feet that God loves him. First feed him and give him some shoes, then tell him that God loves him".

[Abiel]

If I may quote General Booth on this subject

Of course you may!

[Andy Broadley]

Why thank you so much. Thats very kind of you;)

[chaplainjared]

The salvos was definatly founded on the basis that the motto is for fire from the holy spirit, and blood of jesus. where has the fire gone? well that depends on the corp you go to. I would say that there is plenty of life in my particular corp and also many others, while some are still 'dead'. I think the problem was our leaders of the past turned it into 'their army' instead of 'gods army', sort of making an exclusive club for the 'captains, majors' out there....things are changing (well in SOUTH AUS they are) we are more passionate, more fired up and ready to win the world for jesus.

[Abiel]

Also. in some places it thuned in to a glorified musical society...well God solved that on here!
I have talked to some old timers about this, and they tell me that in the post war years, the Army was very good at showing compassion to those outside the Army in need, but wasn't so good at loving each other in times of need. Lots of people left feeling unloved. Very sad.

[Abiel]

I have a life long salvo friend 80+ years old. She told me that she is so glad that she has lived this long to see the Army start to turn around.

[chaplainjared]

hey everyone, check out my rusty sword! cool hey.... well its a start!
He he he. Got a job now too! :)

[elm0]

Hey jared, in case you don't know yet, you can get a Sally Shield for your armour for FREE!! And I just gave you some more blessings, so you can maybe grab yourself some more armour ;)

[chickette]

Wats an Apprentice?

[elm0]

Wats an Apprentice?

I guess you're refferring to the little apprentice in the top right of my posts. If you click on the jobs link at the top of the page (next to armour) you'll see a whole page of different jobs. You can become an apprentice after you've made 100 posts and you get an extra 5 blessings every week. Then you can get better jobs at different post counts. I got about 40 posts to go before I can go up a level :)

[Andy Broadley]

Bit like being a junior soldier

[Abiel]

Except the pay is better!

[elm0]

I'm moving up in the world! At least in the CF world. I'm a private now.

[Andy Broadley]

I'm moving up in the world! At least in the CF world. I'm a private now.


Private? Thought you was colour Sergeant. The pay is lousy, but the stripes look nice on your uniform.

[elm0]

Private? Thought you was colour Sergeant. The pay is lousy, but the stripes look nice on your uniform.

I can be a sergeant in the SA, while being a Private in the CF army..... can't I?

[Andy Broadley]

Another 100 posts and you get another promotion to soldier

[Gumdrop71]

"It's no good telling a man who is hungry and has nothing on his feet that God loves him. First feed him and give him some shoes, then tell him that God loves him".
===================================
Yep. The book of James has something like that as well. BOTH men are correct!

[Andy Broadley]

"It's no good telling a man who is hungry and has nothing on his feet that God loves him. First feed him and give him some shoes, then tell him that God loves him".
===================================
Yep. The book of James has something like that as well. BOTH men are correct!


Too right