Thinking about changing religions

[Aimee30]

My church is thinking about adopting new ways that I don't necessarily agree with. I don't want to change to the WELS synod of Lutherans because they are too strict. The synod I am in is ELCA. Are there any other Lutheran synods out there? Perhaps you can tell me more about another Christian religion I might join. It can't be too strict--i.e. women are to be seen and not heard in play, restrictions on music, openly against certain groups of people, etc.

You might want to private message me on this one--or if you feel it can be worthy of being apologetic in this thread, you can post it right here--but don't go into any areas that can get me in trouble. Thanks.

[cygnusx1]

My church is thinking about adopting new ways that I don't necessarily agree with. I don't want to change to the WELS synod of Lutherans because they are too strict. The synod I am in is ELCA. Are there any other Lutheran synods out there? Perhaps you can tell me more about another Christian religion I might join. It can't be too strict--i.e. women are to be seen and not heard in play, restrictions on music, openly against certain groups of people, etc.

You might want to private message me on this one--or if you feel it can be worthy of being apologetic in this thread, you can post it right here--but don't go into any areas that can get me in trouble. Thanks.

My advice for what it's worth sister , is that you discuss this in house with fellow Lutherans ..... :hug:
http://www.christianforums.com/f367-theologia-crucis-confessional-lutherans.html

[brightlights]

There comes an interesting question. If you can't be a good [insert religion] should you change religion or should you stick with it?

So if you cannot follow truth well, should you abandon truth?

[Evee]

Do you mean change denominations?
To me there is a big difference in changing denominations and changing religion.
I don't really consider myself religious anyway.

[bloodofthelamb12]

Well if you are a Lutheran, you might appreciate a Methodist church; but you'd likely prefer a conservative one. heh heh - I just realized I recommended a different denomination than my own. ^_^ ooooh well.

-and btw,
You could try posting this question in the Questions for Christians part

[Sojourner1]

Perhaps you can tell me more about another Christian religion I might join. It can't be too strict--i.e. women are to be seen and not heard in play, restrictions on music, openly against certain groups of people, etc.

I don't know if there are any in your area, but I would highly recommend visiting a Calvary Chapel church. Go to their website to see if there is a church in your city, http://www.calvarychapel.com/

[InspiredHome]

I would recommend the web site of Plain Truth Ministries. They focus on Christianity (the relationship) vs. religion. They are at www.ptm.org (http://www.ptm.org) and might help you in your search for a church. There is also an amusing article on their web site at

http://www.ptm.org/04PT/NovDec/churchShopping.pdf


Hugs and ferrets!

[Aimee30]

I guess this would run more along denomination than like say changing to Taoism or something of the like. Thanks for the responses I will check them out.

[Lutherrunner]

I don't know if there are any in your area, but I would highly recommend visiting a Calvary Chapel church. Go to their website to see if there is a church in your city, http://www.calvarychapel.com/

Ummm....they are fundamentalists who believe women should submit to men and they are quite harsh regarding homosexuality......

I can't imagine that you'd find anything much more liberal than an ELCA....

[InspiredHome]

a dearly loved child of God. :)

[Aimee30]

Ummm....they are fundamentalists who believe women should submit to men and they are quite harsh regarding homosexuality......

I can't imagine that you'd find anything much more liberal than an ELCA....
I don't want a liberal church I want one more geared toward a moderate like myself. I am sick of plays in church services, I am sick of seeing people in the lobby exchanging goods for donations, blurring the lines of acceptable behavior, wearing unacceptable clothing revealing too much skin--i.e. short skirts, low cut tops, tanks tops, short shorts into the church building, and hearing about sports teams such as the Packers.

What I don't want in a new church is men being controllers of women, complete bigotry, women not being considered as equal in the eyes of God as men (although what some consider equality I don't--like being outside of humliity (loud, rude behavior) or wanting the right to have any type of abortion), and calling people anti-christs if they don't agree.

If you must know I disagree with a new proposal to change the minds of ELCA about liturgical blessings of gay people as a couple in front of the church. I do not hate them, but I do not want young children to be exposed to this at church. I believe that they are going through a struggle and can be accepted among the other members of the church as we are all sinners, but when it might give children the wrong impression, I don't want to be involved. ( I know that this might be offensive to some people but it is how I feel and I have a right to belong to a religion that reflects what I believe).

I do want to go to a church that expresses the true love and caring Jesus had, but I don't want to blur lines of morality so to speak. We are all brothers and sisters--I know--but I just want a church that doesn't desensitize itself to things the Bible mentioned as not totally right behavior.

[InspiredHome]

You might try just a basic Christian church...try looking in the phonebook under Churches, Christian. They are pretty moderate in themselves...not too strict yet not too liberal. My church is called Rocky Mountain Christian Church and I really enjoy it. They give opportunities for Bible study, for community service...just basically well rounded. I've been attending for a little over 3 years now. I came from a legalistic church.

[kedaman]

How come wordly politics play part in your faith?

1 Corinthians 6

Lawsuits Among Believers

1If any of you has a dispute with another, dare he take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the saints? 2Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases? 3Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life! 4Therefore, if you have disputes about such matters, appoint as judges even men of little account in the church![a (http://bible.gospelcom.net/passage/?book_id=53&chapter=6&version=31#fen-NIV-28456a)] 5I say this to shame you. Is it possible that there is nobody among you wise enough to judge a dispute between believers? 6But instead, one brother goes to law against another–and this in front of unbelievers!
7The very fact that you have lawsuits among you means you have been completely defeated already. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be cheated? 8Instead, you yourselves cheat and do wrong, and you do this to your brothers.


I don't want a liberal church I want one more geared toward a moderate like myself. I am sick of plays in church services, I am sick of seeing people in the lobby exchanging goods for donations, blurring the lines of acceptable behavior, wearing unacceptable clothing revealing too much skin--i.e. short skirts, low cut tops, tanks tops, short shorts into the church building, and hearing about sports teams such as the Packers.

What I don't want in a new church is men being controllers of women, complete bigotry, women not being considered as equal in the eyes of God as men (although what some consider equality I don't--like being outside of humliity (loud, rude behavior) or wanting the right to have any type of abortion), and calling people anti-christs if they don't agree.

If you must know I disagree with a new proposal to change the minds of ELCA about liturgical blessings of gay people as a couple in front of the church. I do not hate them, but I do not want young children to be exposed to this at church. I believe that they are going through a struggle and can be accepted among the other members of the church as we are all sinners, but when it might give children the wrong impression, I don't want to be involved. ( I know that this might be offensive to some people but it is how I feel and I have a right to belong to a religion that reflects what I believe).

I do want to go to a church that expresses the true love and caring Jesus had, but I don't want to blur lines of morality so to speak. We are all brothers and sisters--I know--but I just want a church that doesn't desensitize itself to things the Bible mentioned as not totally right behavior.

[InspiredHome]

Ehh what?

[Bradford]

Mod recordkeeping note:

Thread moved from General APologetics to Theologia Crucis- Confessional Lutherans

[cenimo]

Did I miss it, in the OP she said ELCA and didn't want to go WELS.
What about LCMS? I haven't seen it mentioned.

[Jim47]

I don't want a liberal church I want one more geared toward a moderate like myself. I am sick of plays in church services, I am sick of seeing people in the lobby exchanging goods for donations, blurring the lines of acceptable behavior, wearing unacceptable clothing revealing too much skin--i.e. short skirts, low cut tops, tanks tops, short shorts into the church building, and hearing about sports teams such as the Packers.

What I don't want in a new church is men being controllers of women, complete bigotry, women not being considered as equal in the eyes of God as men (although what some consider equality I don't--like being outside of humliity (loud, rude behavior) or wanting the right to have any type of abortion), and calling people anti-christs if they don't agree.

If you must know I disagree with a new proposal to change the minds of ELCA about liturgical blessings of gay people as a couple in front of the church. I do not hate them, but I do not want young children to be exposed to this at church. I believe that they are going through a struggle and can be accepted among the other members of the church as we are all sinners, but when it might give children the wrong impression, I don't want to be involved. ( I know that this might be offensive to some people but it is how I feel and I have a right to belong to a religion that reflects what I believe).

I do want to go to a church that expresses the true love and caring Jesus had, but I don't want to blur lines of morality so to speak. We are all brothers and sisters--I know--but I just want a church that doesn't desensitize itself to things the Bible mentioned as not totally right behavior.


In short, you are looking for a church that teaches good morals, practices good ethics and dress code, adheres its service to preaching The Word of God, not the latest in the news. You also mentioned that you believe in equal rights for women?

Is this summary fairly accurate?

Since this thread was just moved to confessional Lutherans, I have a question.

Where does the importance of having God's Word preached as directed by scriptures come in?

Oh! and Welcome to the Lutheran Confessional forum. :wave:

[sculpturegirl]

Hi Aimee!

I am ELCA and having the same struggles myself! You might want to check out the LCMS. They don't allow women to be pastors, but as I understand it women can vote and serve on boards, etc. The services don't look and sound much different than a traditional ELCA service, except that you might hear a sermon that is more Biblically in depth, depending on the pastor.

I am staying with my church right now. I dearly love the people there and am planning to get married there at the end of the year! I do have some serious beef with the highers-up in the church. Honestly, I feel that much of the congregations out there are very moderate, but being strung along by a liberal leadership. A shame really.

I know a couple here in Maryland who, in disgust with the ELCA, joined an Anglo-Catholic Church in town. It is a very conservative Anglican church.

Where are you located?

[Lutherrunner]

Wow....good luck.....is it the teens that wear the skimpy clothing?.....and what kind of plays?....I see more skits and such at a Bible Church that I have gone to with the girlfriend.....and they are very fundamental, women are supposed to be submissive and gays are going to hell....it's a bit odd that you are looking for some place liberal enough that will have women pastors but not be at least slightly accepting of gays.....I'm not sure you can find what you are looking for, but I could be wrong....and when you talk of bigotry, are you talking racism?....I didn't think Lutherans were racist, but there tends to be a lot of Anglos there just cuz we're mostly of German and Scandanavian background, although in Dallas there are Spanish Lutheran churches.....now the more conservative Lutheran denominations aren't really big on women having leadership roles.....

[filosofer]

In addition to the LCMS, consider the TAALC.

[Lutherrunner]

In addition to the LCMS, consider the TAALC.

TAALC? could you spell that out please?

[pastel]

In addition to the LCMS, consider the TAALC.

Ok, I've been LCMS for several years ....about 14 years now. I've never heard of TAALC. :o

[AngelusSax]

If you must know I disagree with a new proposal to change the minds of ELCA about liturgical blessings of gay people as a couple in front of the church. I do not hate them, but I do not want young children to be exposed to this at church. I believe that they are going through a struggle and can be accepted among the other members of the church as we are all sinners, but when it might give children the wrong impression, I don't want to be involved.

I feel the same way. However, I don't think the proposal to change the minds of ELCA about liturgical blessings of gay people will pass. At least, not this time. I think there's enough conservative-minded people (theologically) in place to not let it pass. I may be wrong, but I hope not.

You may not have to worry about it just yet, is all I'm saying.

As for women pastors, that's one point which might almost make me stay ELCA even if they do accept the same-sex blessing stuff. The way I see it, a woman can know as much as a man, and God can move women to do wonderful things. In fact, when God wants to do great things, He often calls a man, but when He wants to do extraordinary things, He calls a woman.

The ELCA may have liberal leadership, but this issue was indirectly addressed at the St. Paul Luthean Church's 100th anniversary service (the St. Paul in Ironton, that is, not all St. Paul's everywhere). Bishop Holloway (I think) was talking about a how we live in a world of political correctness, where if we're against this or that we're a bigot or whatnot. But, he said, this church is not meant to be a political church, but a Sola Scriptura church, so any issue up for debate must find its answers in Scripture.

Hope that helps. I know it gave me a sense of comfort that we may not exactly be headed down an irreversible path of homosexual ordination/blessing.

[SPALATIN]

My church is thinking about adopting new ways that I don't necessarily agree with. I don't want to change to the WELS synod of Lutherans because they are too strict. The synod I am in is ELCA. Are there any other Lutheran synods out there? Perhaps you can tell me more about another Christian religion I might join. It can't be too strict--i.e. women are to be seen and not heard in play, restrictions on music, openly against certain groups of people, etc.

You might want to private message me on this one--or if you feel it can be worthy of being apologetic in this thread, you can post it right here--but don't go into any areas that can get me in trouble. Thanks.

You didn't mention the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod. Many of the churches there have women active in the church and most allow women to vote. The only area where women are prohibited is becoming an ordained minister.

[SPALATIN]

Wow....good luck.....is it the teens that wear the skimpy clothing?.....and what kind of plays?....I see more skits and such at a Bible Church that I have gone to with the girlfriend.....and they are very fundamental, women are supposed to be submissive and gays are going to hell....it's a bit odd that you are looking for some place liberal enough that will have women pastors but not be at least slightly accepting of gays.....I'm not sure you can find what you are looking for, but I could be wrong....and when you talk of bigotry, are you talking racism?....I didn't think Lutherans were racist, but there tends to be a lot of Anglos there just cuz we're mostly of German and Scandanavian background, although in Dallas there are Spanish Lutheran churches.....now the more conservative Lutheran denominations aren't really big on women having leadership roles.....

Too bad they moved this to the Lutheran forum, cuz it would be good to get other input....how bout Methodist, Presbyterian, Disciples of Christ?


What? and subject her to even more error? No it is good that this is here in the Lutheran forum. The only problem I see with her and the LCMS would be that she agrees w/ abortion. The LCMS has a stand on abortion that she might not like. It considers abortion to be wrong and is very pro-life. However, as she stated about the gay issue, we are all sinners needing forgiveness. Does God forgive the person who has had an abortion? Yes.

[filosofer]

TAALC? could you spell that out please?

The American Association of Lutheran Churches (http://www.taalc.com/). Formed in the late 1980's - originally those who left the ELCA and originally slightly charistmatic, but now has many former LCMS pastors. If you didn't look at the name, as far as doctrine, they would appear as LCMS.

[sculpturegirl]

The American Association of Lutheran Churches (http://www.taalc.org/). Formed in the late 1980's - originally those who left the ELCA and originally slightly charistmatic, but now has many former LCMS pastors. If you didn't look at the name, as far as doctrine, they would appear as LCMS.

This link ought to be: http://www.taalc.com/

Thanks for the info!!

[IowaLutheran]

It can't be too strict--i.e. women are to be seen and not heard in play, restrictions on music, openly against certain groups of people, etc.



Sounds like you fit right in in the ELCA. Instead of leaving the denomination, I would suggest finding another congregation if you're not happy.

By the way, in two days, the ELCA will disclose the recommendations of the task force on sexuality to clergy, with public release the day after. Regardless of what is said there, keep in mind those are recommendations only - the crucial time will be the vote this summer.

[Aimee30]

Actually, I don't like abortion, did it say I did?

[Tetzel]

You see what happens? You see what happens when you adopt the method of "higher criticism"?

[BigNorsk]

Hi,

If you do decide to go elsewhere, I would recommend checking out the Lutheran Brethren.

We have a congregational form of government so don't deal much with the types of problems you are currently experiencing in the ELCA.

There are 123 congregations here in the US with about 1500 daughter congregations overseas. You can check if one is near you (in the US) here:
http://www.clba.org/people/churches/

Not pushing for people to leave their current congregation, but if you so decide, check us out.

Marv