Who the Anti-christ really is

[Flavius]

I wrote an article here called Sign on your forehead but I got no response.
I wasn't more specific cause I don't know how far I can push this subject being that it's delicate.
I believe it's proovable that in the end,You either get the seal of G-d on your forehead or you get the 666 of Babylon on your forehead.The way you attain either is the same way.What you celebrate.
Exodus-13, Ezekiel 8..


:idea:

I'de like to know what you wise men think about this. humph you too Henaynia{Speaking to your hidden man inside} Y'all have been at this way longer than me.

[Sephania]

Are you speaking of the yearly commemoration of Pasach? Or the sacrificing of the first male animals and redeeming of the firstborn (human) males?

[Christy4Christ]

*Christy is feeling very nosy right now and wishes to know what is going on*

[Flavius]

Are you speaking of the yearly commemoration of Pasach? Or the sacrificing of the first male animals and redeeming of the firstborn (human) males?
Exodus 13, cellebrate my Passover and it will be a sign on your forehead and right hand forever between me and you and your descendants,also exodus 31-keep my Sabboth and it will be a sign between you and me and your descendents.

Ezekiel 8. Son of man do you see the abominations they commit in the temple? Sun Worship and Weeping for Tammuz{festivals} .Put the seal of G-d on the foreheads of those who mourn for these things being done in the temple. The rest are killed on 6th day,6th month,6th year, as I see it. Cause the date changes at eve. Hoe do you get the seal of G-d on your forehead?

[Henaynei]

Y'all have been at this way longer than me. Watch that stuff yungin'!! Yer only 8 years youn'er than me!! ;)

I wrote an article here called Sign on your forehead but I got no response. I wasn't more specific cause I don't know how far I can push this subject being that it's delicate. I believe it's proovable that in the end,You either get the seal of G-d on your forehead or you get the 666 of Babylon on your forehead.The way you attain either is the same way.What you celebrateI can see a reference to the "sign" on the forehead here .....
:14 When, at some future time, your son asks you, 'What is this?' then say to him, 'With a strong hand ADONAI brought us out of Egypt, out of the abode of slavery. 15 When Pharaoh was unwilling to let us go, ADONAI killed all the firstborn males in the land of Egypt, both the firstborn of humans and the firstborn of animals. This is why I sacrifice to ADONAI any male that is first from the womb of an animal, but all the firstborn of my sons I redeem.' 16 This will serve as a sign on your hand and at the front of a headband around your forehead that with a strong hand ADONAI brought us out of Egypt."

And a reverence to abominal worship here........
:13 He also said to me, "You will see even worse abominations that they are doing." 14 He brought me to the entrance of the north gate to ADONAI's house; and there before me were women weeping for Tammuz. 15 "Human being," he asked me, "have you seen this? You will see practices even more disgusting than these." 16 He brought me into the inner courtyard of ADONAI's house; and there, at the entrance to the temple of ADONAI, between the porch and the altar, were about twenty-five men with their backs toward the temple of ADONAI and their faces toward the east; and they were worshipping the sun toward the east. 17 He asked me, "Human being, have you seen this? Does the house of Y'hudah consider it a casual matter that they commit the disgusting practices they are committing here, thus filling the land with violence, provoking me still more? Look! They are even putting the branch to their nose! 18 Therefore I will act in fury, my eye will not spare, I will have no pity. Even if they cry loudly right in my ears, I will not listen to them." But, I don't see how these two sections are connected??

[visionary]

Can't buy or sell unless you have the mark. He is probably looking for the mark that the Bible is trying to warn him against. We know it is a mark of worship. It is difficult to understand how worship and buying and selling can be enforced together.

[Flavius]

To my understanding, Sun worship is Saturnalia or the winter solestice{birth of the sun} and that Tammuz is the resurected Nimrod wich every year the fertility dies because of winter and they look once again every year for the resurection of nimrod,so they weep for the coming of Tammuz.I believe this festival is now called Ishtar. Nimrod's mother/wife gets pregnant after the death of nimrod and has another son and calls him Tammuz,the resurected Nimrod.In Ezekiel 8 the people die for practice of these festivals.The people who mourn about these things being done are marked on their forehead with the seal of g-d for not doing them like exodus 13 states. celebrate my passover and it will be a sign of ur forehead. One group celebrates Passover.the other group are killed for doing sun worship and Ishtar.

You cannot buy or sell without involving yourself in Paganism because you can't find a store that doesn't promote pagan festivals thus you involve yourself buy giving your money to people who promote pagan practices.

Well I am kinda goofy but that's how I see it.I don't mean to hurt anybodys feelings but maybe I'm wrong,If I am I need to find that out.

[Christy4Christ]

To my understanding, Sun worship is Saturnalia or the winter solestice{birth of the sun} and that Tammuz is the resurected Nimrod wich every year the fertility dies because of winter and they look once again every year for the resurection of nimrod,so they weep for the coming of Tammuz.I believe this festival is now called Ishtar. Nimrod's mother/wife gets pregnant after the death of nimrod and has another son and calls him Tammuz,the resurected Nimrod.In Ezekiel 8 the people die for practice of these festivals.The people who mourn about these things being done are marked on their forehead with the seal of g-d for not doing them like exodus 13 states. celebrate my passover and it will be a sign of ur forehead. One group celebrates Passover.the other group are killed for doing sun worship and Ishtar.

You cannot buy or sell without involving yourself in Paganism because you can't find a store that doesn't promote pagan festivals thus you involve yourself buy giving your money to people who promote pagan practices.

Well I am kinda goofy but that's how I see it.I don't mean to hurt anybodys feelings but maybe I'm wrong,If I am I need to find that out.

So then who are the people that are still involving themselves in Paganism?

[Flavius]

Watch that stuff yungin'!! Yer only 8 years youn'er than me!! ;)

I can see a reference to the "sign" on the forehead here .....


And a reverence to abominal worship here........
But, I don't see how these two sections are connected??

I wasn't callin you old.I met my first Messianic 3 years ago,before that I had never heard the word Sukkot in my life.I was Anti-semitic and didn't have a clue about Torah.I had never considered even reading the law,whereas you people on here seem to know so much more than me.I take it that you have been a messianic a long time

[ShirChadash]

To my understanding, Sun worship is Saturnalia or the winter solestice{birth of the sun} and that Tammuz is the resurected Nimrod wich every year the fertility dies because of winter and they look once again every year for the resurection of nimrod,so they weep for the coming of Tammuz.I believe this festival is now called Ishtar. Nimrod's mother/wife gets pregnant after the death of nimrod and has another son and calls him Tammuz,the resurected Nimrod.In Ezekiel 8 the people die for practice of these festivals.The people who mourn about these things being done are marked on their forehead with the seal of g-d for not doing them like exodus 13 states. celebrate my passover and it will be a sign of ur forehead. One group celebrates Passover.the other group are killed for doing sun worship and Ishtar.

You cannot buy or sell without involving yourself in Paganism because you can't find a store that doesn't promote pagan festivals thus you involve yourself buy giving your money to people who promote pagan practices.

Well I am kinda goofy but that's how I see it.I don't mean to hurt anybodys feelings but maybe I'm wrong,If I am I need to find that out.
Dh and I have kicked around a similar discussion, Flavius. You aren't alone. I can't say that you are right or wrong... but I wanted to say others of us have delved into such areas as well... and will continue to.

[Henaynei]

I wasn't callin you old.I met my first Messianic 3 years ago,before that I had never heard the word Sukkot in my life.I was Anti-semitic and didn't have a clue about Torah.I had never considered even reading the law,whereas you people on here seem to know so much more than me.I take it that you have been a messianic a long time
LOL - I *was* just kidding you :D

I have only been in MJism for about 17 years - there are others who are *much* "older" than I ;) (ain't it grand??!)

[visionary]

It is neccessary for all laws to come to be enforced there has be signed and sealed and delivered? The seal has to have three components: the TITLE, THE AUTHORITY, and THE TERRITORY.

Does God's law have his seal on it, and do we have it in our hearts.

Remember the Sabbath, to keep it holy. ........For in six days the Lord (TITLE) made (THE AUTHORITY) heaven and earth, the sea and all that in them is (TERRITORY), and rested the seventh day; wherefore the Lord blessed (Signed) the sabbath day, and hallowed it (SEALED).

Delivered on Mount Sinai year 2000???

[Flavius]

LOL - I *was* just kidding you :D

I have only been in MJism for about 17 years - there are others who are *much* "older" than I ;) (ain't it grand??!)
!7 years. To me You and people like Simchat Torah and Visionary and a whole lot of others are my teachers. You guys have been Messianics for a while now and know what's goin on,I just came to this door.I just have begun to search for my jewish roots,I respect anything you people have to say and I know that I have been so wrong about so many things in the past. i hope everyone will bear with me.I began with preconcieved ideas,then I learned that those ideas were wrong so I'm learning all over again.I write alot and voice my opinion but bless the man that sees when I'm wrong and puts me in my place.I will listen to him and thank him for having at least the compassion for proving me wrong and showing me the light.

[Flavius]

I really respect this author.I think everyone should be well aquainted with this book where he states on the cover that the church worships Tammuz.He traces all paganism back to the same man.There are only two religions in this world babylon or Jersalem. Tammuz or Yeshuah.

When the people of babylon went to Egypt and saw their celebrations they said we don't call him Osirus,we call him Tammuz, In Japan they call him Shen moo, In every country he has a different name but all his worshipers are well known because they all have the same festivals in common.

[visionary]

Anti-Christ

All the religions that face off against our Lord are anti-christ.

The most difficult one will be the imitation of Jesus Christ himself done by Satan that will if possible deceive the very elect. On the day of atonement, the red thread is tied around the scapegoat, who is an identical image of the goat sacrificed on the day of atonement representative of Jesus cleansing the temple once and for all.

Imagine for a moment, up to now. there had been reports of Jesus appearing here or there, but it has only affected the Catholics, but the time is coming when the whole world will experience this phenomone. He will probably copy the appear that Jesus is discribed in Revelation Ch 1. He will probably do the things of Christ like miracles, and the sermon on the mount. His objective is to unite the world under His authority, and will sit on the throne that He claims is for God. He will unite the One World Order. There will be a path of destruction following everywhere he has been, since he is the destoyer. Is He ultimately the abomination of desolation?

Visionary

[Flavius]

When the people from Babylon went to Egypt they saw that their festivals were the same.They said we have these things in common but we call him Tammuz not osirus.When the Egyptians went to the Philistines,they said we have these same Festivals but we call him Horus and Osirus Not Baal.Every country and People have a different name for the Builder of Babylon and a name for his mother/wife the queen of heaven.In Japan his name is Shen moo.When the exployers came to America even the indians had a holy mother and a rightous son.In Mexico there are tens of thousands of Pyramids that the jungles still claim but the ones they have found like in Tulum off the coast of Cancun have the same things in common with that of Egypt.Tulum's pyramid has a square whole in it's temple and every winter solstice the sun beams through that whole only on that one excact day. No diffrent than the shadows that fall off the great pyramid of Egypt that cast its longest shadow on the winter solstice-the birth of the sun.Every country has a diffrent name for the king of Babylon but the fact is.If you celebrate the king of Babylon it doesn't matter what you call him,He is still Tammuz the resurected nimrod,He is still born on the winter solstice.

[Henaynei]

:MOD HAT ON:
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Just as a precaution I thought it would be wisdom to place a reminder in this thread about now.

Bashing other christian denominations or calling them pagan or any other terms that bring into question (in the reader's mind, whether of that denomination or another) the rightness or salvation status of it's members/practitioners is not allowed anywhere on CF and certainly not on our forum.

We haven't necessarily crossed the line yet, but I thought it was a good thing to bring back to our memories

Please re-evaluate any further posts to ensure that we all continue to benefit from the community that Erwin and the Staff have labored to provide for us all.

b'Shalom
Henaynei
Moderator

:MOD HAT OFF:
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We now return you to your regularly scheduled discussion ;) http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/7/7_1_115.gif (http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb001)

[Flavius]

I think I'm all through talking about paganism,So I would like to bring up the holy festival of Festivus that was created by Geroge Castanza's father.I think this warm Festival is worth some attention after all it was celebrated on Sienfeld. festivus is approaching,Is there any other Festivuss pilgrims out there? Please contact me at 555-5555

:wave:

[EchadHashem]

I am certainly confused about the winter solstice worship. I would like to point out that Dec 25 (approximately) is mentioned as a day of blessing in the Tanach.

Hag 2:18 Consider now from this day and upward, from the four and twentieth day of the ninth [month, even] (Tishrei) from the day that the foundation of the LORD'S temple was laid, consider [it].

Hag 2:19 Is the seed yet in the barn? yea, as yet the vine, and the fig tree, and the pomegranate, and the olive tree, hath not brought forth: from this day will I bless [you].

Some consider this to be a Messianic prophecy...i.e. the foundation of YHVH's temple was laid = YAHshua, the Cornerstone. However, it seems to be a ref to conception more than birth....i.e. "seed in barn", "foundation being laid"..etc.

Any other ideas about what it could be a ref to in terms of prophecy...certainly, like most prophecies there was an immediate concrete application.

One idea that I have heard is that this prophecy was the impetous for the Hasmonean's instituting Chanakah. hmmm...

In my little mind, I see a connection to the promises to Avraham...it is through the Seed that Israel is blessed...that all the world is blessed.

Shalom.

[Henaynei]

I am certainly confused about the winter solstice worship. I would like to point out that Dec 25 (approximately) is mentioned as a day of blessing in the Tanach.

Please, tell me where the T'NaKh December 25th is referenced??

[Sephania]

I'll have to look around for my silver pole.............now where did I put that? :scratch:














;)

[EchadHashem]

Please, tell me where the T'NaKh December 25th is referenced??

Haggai 2:18
The 24th of the ninth month (of Jewish calendar) falls from Dec 15-25 from year to year...this is correct right?

Shalom

[Henaynei]

Haggai 2:18
The 24th of the ninth month (of Jewish calendar) falls from Dec 15-25 from year to year...this is correct right?

Shalom
Actually, that is Kislev and can fall anywhere within about a 30-45 day period depending on which of the cycles of the Jewish calendar is applicable that year.

[EchadHashem]

Oops...I meant Kislev. There is a bit of variability here which does make it a bit complicated. What is your take on this verse:

Malachi 2:4 But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.

Is this a translation error? Isn't this a obscure ref to the solstice...i.e. Sun rising.

Don't get me wrong, by the way, I do believe that HaShem's holiday has been misused/abused in its current conception. However, I wonder if there is a common derivation of the currently used holiday and HaShem's holiday. The fact that the common derivation can be traced to Nimrod (at least according to some) does not bother me. It seems likely to me that Nimrod's wife may have invoked a commonly held belief/prophecy about Messiah to gain acceptance of her child as Messiah. I know this would imply that a prophecy existed (not extant today) that was well known...perhaps Noah passed this along. Personally, I think a hint of it is exant in the promise of the Seed given to Eve but this is a bit controversial...at least on this forum. Obviously, there is no information in the prophecy about the time of year one might expect the Seed...that is the part that I suspect has been lost.

Also, do you think the Hag ref is a prophecy? If so, what do you think it is a ref too?

Shalom.

[Henaynei]

Oops...I meant Kislev. There is a bit of variability here which does make it a bit complicated. What is your take on this verse:

Malachi 2:4 But unto you that fear my name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall.

Is this a translation error? Isn't this a obscure ref to the equinox...i.e. Sun rising.

Don't get me wrong, by the way, I do believe that HaShem's holiday has been misused/abused in its current conception. However, I wonder if there is a common derivation of the currently used holiday and HaShem's holiday. The fact that the common derivation can be traced to Nimrod (at least according to some) does not bother me. It seems likely to me that Nimrod's wife may have invoked a commonly held belief/prophecy about Messiah to gain acceptance of her child as Messiah. I know this would imply that a prophecy existed (not extant today) that was well known...perhaps Noah passed this along. Personally, I think a hint of it is exant in the promise of the Seed given to Eve but this is a bit controversial...at least on this forum. Obviously, there is no information in the prophecy about the time of year one might expect the Seed...that is the part that I suspect has been lost.

Also, do you think the Hag ref is a prophecy? If so, what do you think it is a ref too?

Shalom.
Well, first off - Yeshua's birth was Tishri 15th (falls in Spetember/October) on the festival of Sukkot/Booths/Tabernacles.

Secondly, while the Hebrew in the translations I am aware of support the word choice "sun" there is no evidence that it is any reference to the equinox. (IF one went in the direction of a reference to the equinox, there would be no more evidence for the eqinox than for the solstice in this reference.)

The passage seems to have a strong allegorical leaning ("healing in His wings," etc) and the most logical position, it seems to me, is that the reference to "sun" is also allegorical - brightness?? light??.... There is no reference to either the equinox or the solstice in any part of scripture and because these are known fesitvals of pagan idols and G-d forbids worship of idols AND the worship of G-d in any manner that is used to worship idols it is therefore highly unlikely that G-d would sanction such a thing.

my $0.02

[Flavius]

There are 24 divisions of priest And John the babtists fathers was one of those priests.He had to say certain scripture on certain days to where you can pin point what day it was and pretty much pinpoint that john was born on Passover as tradition hold that Elija comes on Passover. Yeshuah comes 6 months later on Sukkot and is circumsized the Eighth day

[EchadHashem]

Well, first off - Yeshua's birth was Tishri 15th (falls in Spetember/October) on the festival of Sukkot/Booths/Tabernacles.

Secondly, while the Hebrew in the translations I am aware of support the word choice "sun" there is no evidence that it is any reference to the equinox. (IF one went in the direction of a reference to the equinox, there would be no more evidence for the eqinox than for the solstice in this reference.)

The passage seems to have a strong allegorical leaning ("healing in His wings," etc) and the most logical position, it seems to me, is that the reference to "sun" is also allegorical - brightness?? light??.... There is no reference to either the equinox or the solstice in any part of scripture and because these are known fesitvals of pagan idols and G-d forbids worship of idols AND the worship of G-d in any manner that is used to worship idols it is therefore highly unlikely that G-d would sanction such a thing.

my $0.02

Ok...look back at the original point. I think if you count 9 months from Kislev 24 you will come to Tishri. I think, as I said early, the Haggai prophecy might refer to conception.

Re: Solstice...it seems that the solstice marks the "rising" of the sun or birth of the sun for the year.

Re: Idols...I see no indication in anything I have said or in any of these verses that supports idol worship. hmmm....

hmmm....

Shalom.