1 Cor 6:14

[Nossa-the-Lame]

1Co 6:14 And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power.

This verse confuses me, why would emphasis be put on G-d to raise up Y'shua, when Y'shua clearly could just resurect himself? This verse seems to be clearly stating two seperate entities(IE hashem and y'shua). Or am I confusing the whole subject entirely? Can someone explain?

[visionary]

1Co 6:14 And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power.God the Father called forth His Son and will also call us forth on the last day.

[Nossa-the-Lame]

Ok, the trinity has always confused me, its never really been explained to me in terms that make me go "Ah, makes perfect sense now :)" And I always thought, from judaism, that G-d is always infinite and finite and all that unexplainable stuff. I guess I need more explainations pwease ;) :)

[Shimshon]

This book I can not get around, overlook, nor explain away. The references of who is speaking is the clue.

Rev 1
1 This is the revelation which God(Father) gave to Yeshua(Son) the Messiah, so that he could show his servants what must happen very soon. He communicated it by sending his angel (Spirit) to his servant Yochanan,

10 I came to be, in the Spirit, on the Day of the Lord; and I heard behind me a loud voice, like a trumpet,

12 I turned around to see who was speaking to me; and when I had turned, I saw seven gold menorahs; 13 and among the menorahs was someone like a Son of Man,

17 When I saw him, I fell down at his feet like a dead man. He placed his right hand upon me and said, "Don't be afraid! I am the First and the Last,

Rev 2
1 "To the angel of the Messianic Community in Ephesus, write: 'Here is the message from the one who holds the seven stars in his right hand and walks among the seven gold menorahs:

7 Those who have ears, let them hear what the Spirit is saying to the Messianic communities. To him winning the victory I will give the right to eat from the Tree of Life which is in God's Gan-'Eden."'


8 "To the angel of the Messianic Community in Smyrna, write: 'Here is the message from the First and the Last, who died and came alive again:

11 Those who have ears, let them hear what the Spirit is saying to the Messianic communities.


and so on.....

I am the First and the Last, who was dead yet lives......hear what the Spirit is saying.....

I am the Father, Son, and Spirit.

This message is from G-d given to Yeshua HaMoshiach who communicated it through the Ruach to Yochanan. He turns to see who is speaking and it is one like the Son of Man who claims he is the First and Last yet was dead and now lives. As he speaks he exhorts to "hear what the Spirit is saying". Father(first and last) Son(dead yet lives) Spirit(hear what the Spirit is saying). No matter how much I want to entertain Modalism, I can not reconcile these scriptures with such a theology. Adonai Echad, The L-rd is One. Yet, Yeshua is Lord? :D Echad implies a compound unity, not a singleness. Or can you possess only "one" side of a coin? Possess only a body without a Spirit? And live? Can you have the indwelling of G-d without his Ruach? Salvation without his Son? No.

b,shalom
Shimshon

[debi b]

It is only called modalism by those who coined the phrase......

[blessed2]

The Son began to take on new and expanded meaning to me when I began to place him in the context of what he is in G-d. He is the WORD of G-d. When I pray in the name of the son, i'm praying that G-d will do these things by his WORD, because he said he would in his WORD, holding him to his WORD and by the promise of his WORD.
The scriptures are full of warning against the things we speak.....what a fire our tongues can kindle. My words go out from me, represent me and my thoughts and create a life of it's own (so to speak) in the hearers of my word. If I speak malice against someone to others....my word may cause those who listened, to dislike the person I spoke against who then might spread those feelings to still more people...etc before you know it, I have by my word created a large group who hate this person who has done nothing to deserve it but I have spiritually assassinated them with my word. We too know the power of the confession of our mouths. The Son is a part of G-d and in all things represents G-d and is sent forth by G-d.
I recently read the book of Adam and Eve. I know that it is considered fable but it had many good lessons. I was impressed that many times in dealing with Adam and Eve it would say "and G-d sent his word to Adam..." this spoken as if a spacific entity as when He sent an angel to them.
Anyhoo.....it's huge and revealing and I'm not sure I can grasp it all myself just yet much less explain it others but I hope this has opened up new thoughts and insights for you.

[blessed2]

P.S. Ever notice that if not every then almost every word that came from Him whether directly or related was scripture found in (or referring to ) either in the OT or in Enoch?

[Shimshon]

P.S. Ever notice that if not every then almost every word that came from Him whether directly or related was scripture found in (or referring to ) either in the OT or in Enoch?verses from "The Infancy Gospel of Thomas"

Whence was this child begotten, that every word of his is certainly accomplished?

5. Joseph called the child apart, admonished Him, saying: Why doest thou such things, and these people suffer, and hate us, and persecute us? Jesus said: I know that these words of thine are not thine own; nevertheless for thy sake I will be silent; but they shall bear their punishment. Soon those that accused Him were struck blind. Those who saw it were much afraid and in great perplexity, and said about Him: Every word which he spoke, whether good or bad, was an act, and became a wonder.

And seeing this, the crowd that was standing by wondered, and said: Truly this child was either God or an angel of God, for every word of his is a certain fact.


Seems even as a child his words were seen and noticed as ACTIONS. Not just statements. Him,,, just noticed how that plays into words with no actions...faith with no visible proof. Saying something but not walking it out.

b'shalom
shimshon

[Henaynei]

Nossa - I don't know whether this will help, or just muddy the waters.... but I invite you to try reading my posts Humanity & Divinity (http://www.christianforums.com/t61227&page=2) on this page and see :)