Which day, Yeshua died, and rose

[Bruce101]

I know that this probably gets asked often, so why break the cycle:D
When was Yeshua executed, which day? And when did He resurrect?
Thanks
Bruce

[koilias]

I know that this probably gets asked often, so why break the cycle:D
When was Yeshua executed, which day? And when did He resurrect?
Thanks
Bruce
Well...Bruce, that one's a toughy from my angle. I have a degree in New Testament Backgrounds (second temple period Judaism). In my field, scholars have been debating this heatedly lately due to many attempts to link Yeshua with the Essenes at Qumran. I'm sure here you will find some nice theories along this trajectory. But of all the ones I've heard, I've yet to hear one that solves every problem. The biggest problem is harmonizing John with the other three gospels. Scholars typically throw up their hands in the air regarding that one...

[Bon]

I know that this probably gets asked often, so why break the cycle:D
When was Yeshua executed, which day? And when did He resurrect?
Thanks
Bruce

I am certainly no scholar....but this is an interesting article....which I am leaning towards in my own beliefs....
...but just as many things of Yahweh are difficult to grasp and understand in their exactness, this subject is no exception.

Check it out anyway... it may be helpful.

http://sabbatarian.com/TableContent/Resurrection.html

Shalom from Bon

[Bruce101]

Bon,
Very good! That gives the the supporting facts to back up what I believe.

Which leads me to the next question.

Everybody,
I know that Sabbath (according to G-d) is fri. evening to Sat. evening, and I know that it was "officially" changed (by man) at the Nicean Council. However, the "Lord's" day is mentioned and is used by many to support having church, and a day of rest on Sunday.

I am trying to get all my facts straight, to support what I already believe.
Thanks
Bruce

[Sephania]

What I believe, and am not going to take the time to back up with scripture right now ( although I can) is that Yeshua resurrected from the dead at the end of Shabbat, that is to say right before sundown on Saturday ( afternoon) .
The gospel of John I believe it is , tells of Mariam going to buy spices for the body at night and at sundown our first of the week begins, after havdalla, stores would be opened, especially since it was the High Holy days and the town was crowded, many people moving around.

Which leaves you with him dying on the stake right before sundown on Wednesday or the forth day of the week. Remember they wanted to break his legs to get him down before the sun went down? So if he was in the grave 3 nights and 3 days, just as in the beginning, that time would be up just before sundown on Saturday, thus still on the weekly Shabbat.

[visionary]

Feast of First Fruits (Sfirat Haomer) is often overlooked in the New Testament, yet it is mentioned a number of times in the New Covenant. Paul, in his first letter to the Messianic Believers in Corinth, shows a vital link between First Fruits and the ministry of Yeshua:

I Cor. 15:20-24 - But the fact is that the Messiah has been raised from the dead, the first fruits of those who have died. For since death came through a man, also the resurrection of the dead has come through a man. For just as in connection with Adam all die, so in connection with the Messiah all will be made alive. But each in his own order; the Messiah is the firstfruits; then those who belong to the Messiah, at the time of his coming; then the culmination, when he hands over the Kingdom of G-d to the father after having put an end to every rulership, yes to every authority and power.

Although many read this passage as a commentary on the order of resurrection, Paul is actually making a technical reference to the holy day of Sfirat Haomer (First Fruits). It is not just that Yeshua was the first to rise bodily from the grave, but that by so doing, He is the direct fulfillment of the feast of First Fruits. We miss a very important Biblical truth by not using the term "First Fruits" as the name of this feast, because "first" implies a second, third, fourth, and so on, and that is the real meaning of this feast. We are not only celebrating the resurrection of Yeshua of First Fruits, we are celebrating the resurrection of the entire body of Messianic Believers, His Church! We shall all be resurrected and go to heaven, just as the L-rd did, "Every man in his own order" as Paul wrote:

For just as in connection with Adam all die, so in connection with the Messiah all will be made alive. But each in his own order; the Messiah is the firstfruits; then those who belong to the Messiah, at the time of his coming 1 Corinthians 15:22,23

It is very easy to understand G-d’s plan of redemption if we understand the feasts. Yeshua was crucified on Passover, placed in the tomb on the Feast of Unleavened Bread and now He celebrates the Feast of First Fruits by rising from the dead and becoming the First Fruits of the dead. Yeshua even presented His proper First Fruits offering to our Father on this Feast:

And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

and came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many. Matthew 27:52,53

Graves were opened and dead people rose and were seen after His resurrection on the streets of Jerusalem. Yeshua gratefully offered the Father the early crops of what will be an overwhelming harvest during these end times.

[Marjorie]

Everybody,
I know that Sabbath (according to G-d) is fri. evening to Sat. evening, and I know that it was "officially" changed (by man) at the Nicean Council.Well, I don't want to get into a debate about Sabbath observance, but just FYI, the Nicean council didn't change the day of the Sabbath... Orthodox Christians consider Saturday to still be the Sabbath and Sunday to be the Lord's Day. The view that Sunday is somehow the Sabbath was a later, mostly Western phenomenon. :)

In IC XC,
Marjorie

[Marjorie]

Visionary, very interesting! I didn't think of that connection before (I knew of the sacrificial term of first fruits but didn't connect it with the actual feast.)

In IC XC,
Marjorie

[visionary]

So if they want to tie the Lord's Day to the First Fruits which is once a year on the first day of the week, that would work better than this weekly sunday replacement theology.

Yeshua did say He was Lord of the Shabbat

[visionary]

After the Passover was over, during the next day in which they were to make preparation for the up coming weekly sabbath, the religious leaders when to the political leaders and asked for assistance in blocking any further events that would point to the one that they crucified being the One. The day following the Passover was not the Sabbath but the preparation day for the weekly Sabbath. Yeshua was in the grave from Passover til First Fruits or Sunday which would be three days.

Matthew 27:62 Now the next day, that followed the day of the preparation, the chief priests and Pharisees came together unto Pilate, 63 Saying, Sir, we remember that that deceiver said, while he was yet alive, After three days I will rise again. 64 Command therefore that the sepulchre be made sure until the third day, lest his disciples come by night, and steal him away, and say unto the people, He is risen from the dead: so the last error shall be worse than the first. 65 Pilate said unto them, Ye have a watch: go your way, make it as sure as ye can. 66 So they went, and made the sepulchre sure, sealing the stone, and setting a watch.

What they failed to realize is that the day after Passover which is the Feast on Unleavened Bread, was declared by God to be a Sabbath (the High Sabbath which John 19:31 talks about) regardless of which day of the week it actually fell on.

John 19:31 The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation, that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the sabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away.

Luke 23:54 And that day was the preparation, and the sabbath drew on.
55 And the women also, which came with him from Galilee, followed after, and beheld the sepulchre, and how his body was laid. 56 And they returned, and prepared spices and ointments; and rested the sabbath day according to the commandment.

Did you notice the preparation then sabbath rest?

Luke 24:1 Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.

[visionary]

If we follow John's chronology, Yeshua and his disciples were settling into the upper room for his Last Supper as the Jerusalem sunset marked the beginning of the 14th day of the first month. In Exodus 12, the Israelites are commanded to kill the Passover Lamb on the 14th day of the 1st month. Yeshua was breaking bread and drinking the wine and introducing the disciples to the Lord’s supper on the evening of the fourteenth day of the month which is a fulfillment of that appointed time. At the beginning of the meal, three pieces of matzoth, an unleavened bread was placed in a bag with three compartments. Then, the piece of matzoth in the middle compartment, where you can see God the Son portrayed, is taken out and broken into two pieces, just like Yeshua is "broken" for us, and hidden. At the Last Supper, while Yeshua is preforming this pageantry He tells them that it is His body broken for them. Later before sundown and the start of another day Yeshua was buried. It was on the latter part of the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread that all this takes place.

Exodus 12:5 Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats: 6 And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening. 7 And they shall take of the blood, and strike it on the two side posts and on the upper door post of the houses, wherein they shall eat it. 8 And they shall eat the flesh in that night, roast with fire, and unleavened bread; and with bitter herbs they shall eat it. 9 Eat not of it raw, nor sodden at all with water, but roast with fire; his head with his legs, and with the purtenance thereof. 10 And ye shall let nothing of it remain until the morning; and that which remaineth of it until the morning ye shall burn with fire.11 And thus shall ye eat it; with your loins girded, your shoes on your feet, and your staff in your hand; and ye shall eat it in haste: it is the LORD's Passover.
Passover is the first feast and on the Jewish calendar around March or April depending on the year in the month they call Nisan. Nisan is the first month of the Jewish religious calendar. Exodus 12-14 tells the story of the first Passover.

Exodus 12:5-6 Your lamb shall be without blemish, a male of the first year: ye shall take it out from the sheep, or from the goats: 6 And ye shall keep it up until the fourteenth day of the same month: and the whole assembly of the congregation of Israel shall kill it in the evening.

Since Yeshua is the our unleaven bread and His blood our memorial of the Passover lamb we no longer have to kill a lamb for this memorial. He is our eternal sacrifice (John 1:29). Yeshua institute new symbols for this most somber occasion.

Matthew 26:26: And as they were eating, Yeshua took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is My body. 27. And He took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; 28. For this is My blood of the New Testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Luke 22:17: And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and said, Take this, and divide it among yourselves: 18. For I say unto you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine, until the kingdom of God shall come. 19. And He took bread, and gave thanks, and brake it, and gave unto them, saying, This is My body which is given for you: this do in remembrance of Me. 20. Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup is the new testament in My blood, which is shed for you.

John 13:3 Yeshua knowing that the FATHER had given all things into His hands, and that He was come from God, and went to God; 4. He riseth from supper, and laid aside His garments; and took a towel, and girded Himself. 5. After that He poureth water into a basin, and began to wash the disciples' feet, and to wipe them with the towel wherewith He was girded. 12. So after He had washed their feet, and had taken His garments, and was set down again, He said unto them, Know ye what I have done to you? 13. Ye call Me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am. 14. If I then, your Lord and Master, have washed your feet; ye also ought to wash one another's feet. 15. For I have given you an example that ye should do as I have done to you.

You can see that the unleavened bread was given to represent Yeshua sinless body sacrificed in our place when we deserved to die for our sins. The wine represents His shed blood to cover our sins. The foot washing given to represent how as He has served us so we are to serve one another.

[Bruce101]

Marjorie,
That is a nice picture that you use. Who is that? I like old pictures.

Actually, it was mandated at the Nicean Council of 364 CE in Canon 29;

"Christians must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath,but must work on that day, rather honoring the Lord's Day; and if they can, resting then as Christians. But if any shall be found to be judaizers, let them be anethema from Christ."

In other words, if you honor the 4th commandment, may you separated from Christ.

This is where I get the notion that man changed G-d's law. But I also know that in the Brit Hadasha (NT) the Lord's Day is mentioned a couple of times. And am now trying to find out the history, or reason of going from day 6 to day 7.

I did not know that the Orthodox Church kept the Sabbath. Would that be the Greek Orthodox?
Bruce

[Marjorie]

Yes, I am familiar with that canon... however that was at the Council of Laodicea, not the Council of Nicea (which was in 325)... Nicea was an ecumenical council, Laodicea just a local council, and I disagree with what was decided at that council (I have Shabbat dinner with my family and I do not consider myself anathema. :D)

Anyway even the Council of Laodicea doesn't move the Sabbath to Sunday but only (wrongly, IMO) says that Christians MUST NOT rest on the Sabbath, which is Saturday. The switch of the Sabbath to Sunday was a later Western innovation.

Sorry if I wasn't clear on what I meant!

In IC XC,
Marjorie

[visionary]

The switch of the Sabbath to Sunday was a later Western innovation.How can that be western innovation, since the practice was before North America was found?

[Marjorie]

How can that be western innovation, since the practice was before North America was found?By Western I meant all of the West, including Europe... or something that happened in the Western Church, stationed in Rome. In general the Orthodox Church is considered "Eastern" even if this title isn't completely correct, and the Catholic Church (and Protestantism) considered "Western."

In IC XC,
Marjorie

[visionary]

During the first century after Yeshua

JOSEPHUS
"There is not any city of the Grecians, nor any of the Barbarians, nor any nation whatsoever, whither our custom of resting on the seventh day hath not come!" M'Clatchie, "Notes and Queries on China and Japan" (edited by Dennys), Vol 4, Nos 7, 8, p.100.

PHILO
Declares the seventh day to be a festival, not of this or of that city, but of the universe. M'Clatchie, "Notes and Queries," Vol. 4, 99

"The primitive Christians had a great veneration for the Sabbath, and spent the day in devotion and sermons. And it is not to be doubted but they derived this practice from the Apostles themselves, as appears by several scriptures to the purpose." "Dialogues on the Lord's Day," p. 189. London: 1701, By Dr. T.H. Morer (A Church of England divine).

"...The Sabbath was a strong tie which united them with the life of the whole people, and in keeping the Sabbath holy they followed not only the example but also the command of Jesus." "Geschichte des Sonntags," pp.13, 14

"The primitive Christians did keep the Sabbath of the Jews;...therefore the Christians, for a long time together, did keep their conventions upon the Sabbath, in which some portions of the law were read: and this continued till the time of the Laodicean council." "The Whole Works" of Jeremy Taylor, Vol. IX,p. 416 (R. Heber's Edition, Vol XII, p. 416).

"From the apostles' time until the council of Laodicea, which was about the year 364, the holy observance of the Jews' Sabbath continued, as may be proved out of many authors: yea, notwithstanding the decree of the council against it." "Sunday a Sabbath." John Ley, p.163. London: 1640.

[visionary]

Other ancient documentations of shabbat keepers worshipping Yeshua.

EGYPT (OXYRHYNCHUS PAPYRUS) (200-250 A.D.)
"Except ye make the sabbath a real sabbath (sabbatize the Sabbath," Greek), ye shall not see the Father." "The oxyrhynchus Papyri," pt,1, p.3, Logion 2, verso 4-11 (London Offices of the Egypt Exploration Fund, 1898).

AFRICA (ALEXANDRIA) ORIGEN
"After the festival of the unceasing sacrifice (the crucifixion) is put the second festival of the Sabbath, and it is fitting for whoever is righteous among the saints to keep also the festival of the Sabbath. There remaineth therefore a sabbatismus, that is, a keeping of the Sabbath, to the people of God (Hebrews 4:9)." "Homily on Numbers 23," par.4, in Migne, "Patrologia Graeca," Vol. 12,cols. 749, 750.

PALESTINE TO INDIA (CHURCH OF THE EAST)
As early as A.D. 225 there existed lallrge bishoprics or conferences of the Church of the East (Sabbath-keeping) stretching from Palestine to India. Mingana, "Early Spread of Christianity." Vol.10, p. 460.

INDIA (BUDDHIST CONTROVERSY), 220 A.D.)
The Kushan Dynasty of North India called a famous council of Buddhist priests at Vaisalia to bring uniformity among the Buddhist monks on the observance of their weekly Sabbath. Some had been so impressed by the writings of the Old Testament that they had begun to keep holy the Sabbath. Lloyd, "The Creed of Half Japan," p. 23.

ITALY AND EAST-C 4th
"It was the practice generally of the Easterne Churches; and some churches of the west...For in the Church of Millaine (Milan);...it seems the Saturday was held in a farre esteeme... Not that the Easterne Churches, or any of the rest which observed that day, were inclined to Iudaisme (Judaism); but that they came together on the Sabbath day, to worship Iesus (Jesus) Christ the Lord of the Sabbath." "History of the Sabbath" (original spelling retained), Part 2, par. 5, pp.73, 74. London: 1636. Dr. Heylyn.

ORIENT AND MOST OF WORLD
"The ancient Christians were very careful in the observance of Saturday, or the seventh day...It is plain that all the Oriental churches, and the greatest part of the world, observed the Sabbath as a festival...Athanasius likewise tells us that they held religious assembles on the Sabbath, not because they were infected with Judaism, but to worship Jesus, the Lord of the Sabbath, Epiphanius says the same." "Antiquities of the Christian Church," Vol.II Book XX, chap. 3, sec.1, 66. 1137,1138.

ABYSSINIA
"In the last half of that century St. Ambrose of Milan stated officially that the Abyssinian bishop, Museus, had 'traveled almost everywhere in the country of the Seres' (China). For more than seventeen centuries the Abyssinian Church continued to sanctify Saturday as the holy day of the fourth commandment." Ambrose, DeMoribus, Brachmanorium Opera Ominia, 1132, found in Migne, Patrologia Latima, Vol.17, pp.1131,1132.


ARABIA, PERSIA, INDIA, CHINA
"Mingana proves that in 370 A.D. Abyssinian Christianity (a Sabbath keeping church) was so popular that its famous director, Musacus, travelled extensively in the East promoting the church in Arabia, Persia, India and China." "Truth Triumphanat,"p.308 (Footnote 27).

SPAIN-COUNCIL ELVIRA (A.D.305)
Canon 26 of the Council of Elvira reveals that the Church of Spain at that time kept Saturday, the seventh day. "As to fasting every Sabbath: Resolved, that the error be corrected of fasting every Sabbath." This resolution of the council is in direct opposition to the policy the church at Rome had inaugurated, that of commanding Sabbath as a fast day in order to humiliate it and make it repugnant to the people.

SPAIN
It is a point of further interest to note that in north-eastern Spain near the city of Barcelona is a city called Sabadell, in a district originaly inhabited. By a people called both "Valldenses" and Sabbatati."

PERSIA-A.D. 335-375 (40 YEARS PERSECUTION UNDER SHAPUR II)
The popular complaint against the Christians-"They despise our sungod, they have divine services on Saturday, they desecrate the sacred the earth by burying their dead in it." Truth Triumphant," p.170.

PERSIA-A.D.335-375
"They despise our sun-god. Did not Zorcaster, the sainted founder of our divine beliefs, institute Sunday one thousand years ago in honour of the sun and supplant the Sabbath of the Old Testament. Yet these Christians have divine services on Saturday." O'Leary, "The Syriac Church and Fathers," pp.83, 84.

[By Grace]

vis, why didn't the women take the spices to the tomb on the 6th day of the week? That would have been the first day they could have done that work, rather than waiting until after the weekly Sabbath?

TIA,

[visionary]

vis, why didn't the women take the spices to the tomb on the 6th day of the week? That would have been the first day they could have done that work, rather than waiting until after the weekly Sabbath?

TIA,My understanding is that the spices that they had to prepare for embalming takes time, and this they have to add to their already full day of preparation for the sabbath, and the clean-up from the High Day (Feast of Unleaven Bread). Kind of a full day of work,...and maybe the Lord had something to do with keeping them from making embalming the high priority on their list of things to do????

Anyone else have any ideas why the women who were cleaning up after the Feast of Unleaven Bread, preparing for the Sabbath, did not find time to prepare the spices and get over and embalm Yeshua?

[Bon]

Could it be possible that the women knew that the tomb was sealed and guarded?

Did they know that Yahshua had said that He would be in the tomb for three days and three nights? (although they were surprised when He was not there when they came to the tomb)

Perhaps it has something to do with the guards being relieved of their duties after a certain period.

[visionary]

Maybe that is how they found out about the sealing, was when they came with the spices, they learned about the guards at the tomb. Then there was not enough time, to get authority to get past the guards to embalm Yeshua.

Everything is speculative as to why the wait and I am sure others can think of other reason we have not yet come up with as to why the women didn't embalm Yeshua on friday.

[Sephania]

If wed sundown to thurs sundown was the sabbath of Passover and thursday sundown to friday sundown the Shabbat of unleavened bread, then friday sundown to satu sundown the weekly sabbat, then the first they would be able to buy would be saturday after havdallah.

As far as first fruits being the L-rds day? not sure how that equates with Yocahanans vison on the L-RDs day,was this the day of first fruits? Or weekly Shabbat when the heavens are open to those in prayer?

[Shimshon]

If wed sundown to thurs sundown was the sabbath of Passover and thursday sundown to friday sundown the Shabbat of unleavened bread, then friday sundown to satu sundown the weekly sabbat, then the first they would be able to buy would be saturday after havdallah.

As far as first fruits being the L-rds day? not sure how that equates with Yocahanans vison on the L-RDs day,was this the day of first fruits? Or weekly Shabbat when the heavens are open to those in prayer?

Zayit, is pesach a 'shabbat'? I don't believe it is. the 15 is the first day of the feast of unleavened bread and a shabbat. But the Pesach is a mitzvah in and of itself however not a shabbat. Thus, the timeline would be 14th Pesach, 15th Shabbat for feast of unleavened bread, 17th weekly shabbat and the day of reserection. As after sundown (first day of the week) they ran to the tomb to pour the spices on the body (havdallah). This coresponds with the bringing in of the pesach lamb to the temple 4 days before the sacrifice (10th, weekly shabbat). This would as well explain why Yeshua was very disturbed to find people selling items to sacrifice in the temple courtyard and turned the tables over. HE was the sacrifce that was unable to be bought with money.

This also proves the days of "good friday" and "palm sunday" are not in agreement with the actual scripture.

[Sephania]

I stand corrected.

Passover
Unleavened bread
Day of preparation
firstfruits

That would mean he arose on Sunday? or Saturday after sundown?

[Shimshon]

That would mean he arose on Sunday? or Saturday after sundown?
It would mean he rose exactly 3 full days later from the 14th, late afternoon on the 17th, shabbat. As the sun went down and the day changed from the 17th to the 18th (yom rishon, "first day) the spices were prepared. They did not have time to prepare the spices nor anoint Yeshua with them as it was late in the day and shabbat (feast of unleaven bread) was quickly aproching. The very next morning (still yom rishon) they brought to the tomb so the body could be anointed with spices (Taharah/havdallah). But they found it gone.

[Sephania]

To make a separation from the profane to the Holy?

[Bon]

I believe that when Yahshua said three days and three nights.....he meant exactly what He said.....72 hours.

Why do some say that a day can be any part thereof?
Is this really a Jewish belief, that even if it were just a couple of hours, it is still considered a day?

Would Yahshua's sign be so unprecise? And why would He quote the "Johah sign" of three days and three nights, if it was, or could have been, just 'parts' of a day.

convicted but confussed.....Bon

[Bon]

ooooopppppps! double post.

I hate when I do that :sigh:

[Sephania]

Why do some say that a day can be any part thereof?
Cause that's the only way you can get a Friday crucifixtion and a Sunday morning arising to uphold the Sunday as "Resurection day".

[By Grace]

Cause that's the only way you can get a Friday crucifixtion and a Sunday morning arising to uphold the Sunday as "Resurection day".
So it's totally a "Christian" explanation and not a "Judaism" thing at all? I've had people tell me that Jews count it a day even if it's only part of the day.

[visionary]

The fifteenth of Nisan begins the Feast of Unleavened Bread, which is a high sabbath, a shabbaton. It is a seven day feast to the Lord. The day following the sabbath during Passover is called the Feast of First Fruits (Leviticus 23:10-11).

Remember, three times a year G-d commanded the people to come to Jerusalem to celebrate the festivals of Passover (Pesach), Pentecost (Shavuot), and Tabernacles (Sukkot). All three of these festivals are agricultural harvest festivals. Passover (Pesach) is the barley harvest. Pentecost (Shavuot) is the wheat harvest. Both of these festivals are first fruits harvests before the final harvest that was to come at the end of the year during the festival of Tabernacles (Sukkot), which is the fruit harvest.

The harvest represents all who would put their faith, trust, and confidence (emunah) in the Messiah Yeshua (Matthew 13:39; Mark 4:26-29; Luke 10:1-12; Revelation 14:14-16). So, the sheaf is the first of the first fruits. Since a sheaf in the Bible is used to typify a person or persons (Genesis 37:5-11), a sheaf spiritually represents people who accept the Messiah into their hearts. Everything on the earth, both man and beast, was to be presented before the L-rd as first fruits to Him.

Yeshua is the First Fruits of the Barley Harvest, firstborn of Mary (Matthew 1:23-25),
first-begotten of God the Father (Hebrews 1:6), firstborn of every creature (Colossians 1:15), first-begotten from the dead (Revelation 1:5), firstborn of many brethren (Romans 8:29), and first fruits of the resurrected ones (1 Corinthians 15:20,23). Since Yeshua is the beginning of the creation of G-d (Revelation 3:14),is the preeminent One (Colossians 1:18), indeed the Most Holy One of G-d and is sanctified by the Father; Yeshua is the first, the choicest, the preeminent One. He is both the firstborn of G-d and the first fruits unto G-d. Yeshua is the sheaf of the first fruits.

[Shimshon]

To make a separation from the profane to the Holy?



In the sense that he was made sin and then rose to life eternal...yes.



Havdallah fulfilled in Yeshua......

Yeshua was burning with the light of the shikanah (Ruach) from El Shaddai. (three-fold candle) He was filled to overflowing with the Ruach and is blood overflowed his vessel. He was anointed with the Ruach HaKodesh as a sweet fragrance to remind us and sustain us till the next shabbat (second coming, acharit hayamim).



Yeshua was our Shabbat in whom we must rest in.



Mark 2:19

Yeshua answered them, "Can wedding guests fast while the bridegroom is still with them? As long as they have the bridegroom with them, fasting is out of the question.

20 But the time will come when the bridegroom is taken away from them; and when that day comes, they will fast.





Havdallah fullfilled in us.....

We light the candle wicks (Abba, Yeshua, Ruach "For ADONAI your G-d is a consuming fire, a jealous G-d.) we fill the cup to overflowing (We are more than conquerers in Yeshua, filled with his Ruach to overflowing) we put spices in a box (we are life to all who receive us and death to all who reject...a sweet aroma to all who are being saved)



Havdallah is fullfilled in both of us since his completions dwells in us...no?

[plmarquette]

I know that this probably gets asked often, so why break the cycle:D
When was Yeshua executed, which day? And when did He resurrect?
Thanks
Bruce
some have told us .... according to christian tradition ; that a part of a day , was counted as a day ...crucified on friday ( part ) ; all day saturday ; rose on Sunday ( part ) .. believe this is what the post is referring to ...

I saw the post down a few threads , and have seen part of Zola Levitt's
exposition of the feast of first fruits ... interesting ... good ...
a bridge between traditions , a context for culture , a expostion of
what is lacking

[Shimshon]

some have told us .... according to christian tradition ; that a part of a day , was counted as a day ...crucified on friday ( part ) ; all day saturday ; rose on Sunday ( part ) .. believe this is what the post is referring to ...
On the Shabbat of the 10th of Aviv the pesach lamb was chosen. This very day was the day Yeshua rode into Yerushalayim on a colt, being praised "Hoshannah Ben David! Baruch haba b'Shem Adonai", Save us Son of David, Blessed is he who comes in the name of the L-ord.

This proves the inability for this day to be "palm sunday" It was Shabbat.

Four days later on Yom Revi'i (fourth day "tues eve -wed"), the 14th of Aviv the pesach lamb was to be prepared and sacrificed. This was the night of the "last supper" erev Revi'i. The night Yeshua was arrested in the garden of olives. He was unjustly tried all night in to the morning and by the final hours of Yom Revi'i (fourth day "tues eve -wed") he was found to be dead on the stake, taken and placed in Yosef's tomb. They were hurrying because the sun was going down and that would be the first Shabbat for the feast of unleaven bread. Not having time to prepare the body for burial they placed it in and the guards had it sealed.

He died on Yom Revi'i (the fourth day "wed") the 14th as our pesach sacrifice. Yom Hamishi (the fifth day "thurs") the 15th was Shabbat of the feast of unleavened bread. (DAY ONE)

Yom Shishi (the sixth day "fri") the 16th. (Day TWO)

Yom Shabbat "the weekly Shabbat" (sat) was observed by the talmidim, no work. (Day THREE)

As the sun went down and the Shabbat was over (Yom "erev" Rishon "sun") the women gathered and prepared spices to anoint the body properly, as they could not do this during Shabbat. They must have spend the rest of the night doing so. In the morning Yom Rishon (the first day "sun") they ran to the tomb and found him gone. Sunday they found him gone.....Three full days in the belly of the beast and the fourth he was a reserected being.

[visionary]

On the Shabbat of the 10th of Aviv the pesach lamb was chosen. This very day was the day Yeshua rode into Yerushalayim on a colt, being praised "Hoshannah Ben David! Baruch haba b'Shem Adonai", Save us Son of David, Blessed is he who comes in the name of the L-ord.

This proves the inability for this day to be "palm sunday" It was Shabbat.

How do you prove that Aviv 10 was Shabbat? Not that I disagre with all that you have pointed out, just want verification.

[Bon]

O.K....can I re-cap.

Many here seem to be in agreeance that Yahshua expired at the ninth hour (3p.m.) on the Wednesday. (afternoon of the 14th of Nisan).

He was taken down and placed in the tomb before sunset.....the beginning of the Sabbath, First day of Unleavened Bread, (15th of Nisan).

Yahshua said that He would be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights....(not dead three days and three nights)....????

So He would have risen from the dead just before sunset on the Saturday Sabbath, 17th of Nisan.

And as visionary mentioned or was it Zayit...or both of you????

the Saturday was the first fruits (waving of the sheaf)?

Is this how it goes????

Shalom from Bon

Gota go and pick up my hubby from the airport.

[visionary]

Is this how it goes???? THAT IS THE WAY THAT i SEE IT.

[Sephania]

Me too. A good reason for this is,

I believe that Yeshua was done, He had finished all the work that he came to do, on this seventh day, this Shabbat he rested/ceased from all the work he came to do. On this day HaShem/Yeshua completed the work necessary after the fall of creation, in the garden. It was not creative work, don't get me wrong, but redemptive work that only the L-RD could do himself.

[Shimshon]

How do you prove that Aviv 10 was Shabbat? Not that I disagre with all that you have pointed out, just want verification.
It has to do with the pesach mitzvah seder. If you recall from Sh'mot 12 the order in which G-d defined the pesach mitzvah.

2 "You are to begin your calendar with this month; it will be the first month of the year for you (AVIV)

3 Speak to all the assembly of Isra'el and say, 'On the tenth day of this month, each man is to take a lamb or kid for his family, one per household

6 "'You are to keep it until the fourteenth day of the month, and then the entire assembly of the community of Isra'el will slaughter it at dusk.

The lamb was taken on the 10th, kept till the 14th when it was sacrificed at dusk.

So, we know Yeshua was slaughtered at dusk on the 14th (wed), four days earlier (sat) was Shabbat. Scripture shows on the day Yeshua entered Yerushalayim and the prushim were stirred because as they were praying in the temple for Moshiach to come a huge crowd outside was praising the coming Moshiach. When he entered the temple grounds he drove out those who were doing business. They were changing money for tithes, offerings, and temple taxes and selling items for offerings such as doves on the Shabbat in the Temple.

Mattityahu 21:1-17

[Shimshon]

Bon, Yes I do beleive you understand the timeline

[visionary]

Please reconcile....shimshon

In Exodus chapter 12, are the instructions for the celebration of Passover. The children of Israel were to choose a lamb for the Passover sacrifice on the 10th day of the 1st month, 4 days before the actual slaughtering was to be done.

John 12:1, 13-16 Then Yeshua six days before the Passover came to Bethany, where Lazarus was, which had been dead, whom he raised from the dead.12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Yeshua was coming to Jerusalem,13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.14 And Yeshua, when he had found a young ass, sat thereon; as it is written, 15 Fear not, daughter of Sion: behold, thy King cometh, sitting on an ass's colt. 16 These things understood not his disciples at the first: but when Yeshua was glorified, then remembered they that these things were written of him, and that they had done these things unto him

[ICHTHYS_follower]

I know that this probably gets asked often, so why break the cycle:D
When was Yeshua executed, which day? And when did He resurrect?
Thanks
BruceWell...Bruce, that one's a toughy from my angle. I have a degree in New Testament Backgrounds (second temple period Judaism). In my field, scholars have been debating this heatedly lately due to many attempts to link Yeshua with the Essenes at Qumran. I'm sure here you will find some nice theories along this trajectory. But of all the ones I've heard, I've yet to hear one that solves every problem. The biggest problem is harmonizing John with the other three gospels. Scholars typically throw up their hands in the air regarding that one...I have posted a theory regarding the chronology of Holy Week that I believe solves every problem I am currently aware of. If you could please use your expertise and perspective to test the hypothesis I would appreciate it.

http://www.christianforums.com/t1063747-chronology-of-holy-week.html

[Shimshon]

Please reconcile....shimshon


(Koilias)The biggest problem is harmonizing John with the other three gospels. Scholars typically throw up their hands in the air regarding that one...

Visionary, there it is in a nutshell. These references are not "reconcilable".

Mattityahu 21 starts with the "triumphant entry" into Yerushalayim on a donkey. The next morning (vs 18) he went back to the Temple and taught all day..(mt 21:18 - mt 23) He was questioned by every council of authority repeatedly as he spoke to them his talmidim and all Yerushalayim. At the end of the day he left the Temple (mt 24) and his talmidim asked him when the acharit hayamim would begin. He explains with many parables (mt 24-26) then we have a reference given about Pesach being "two days away" .

So if Pesach was two days away (12th) That would make the "entry" on the 11th. Sunday! :idea:

Yet, Yochanan states; "Six days before Pesach" (Yn 12). (8th) Yeshua and his talmidim were at El'lazar's who he had reserected earlier. "The next day" (vs 12) we have the "entry" on the 9th. Friday! :idea:

And yet again, Sh'mot 12:3 states that the lamb was to be taken 4 days before Pesach on the 10th Shabbat!:scratch: .


o.k. pray it with me. Gal einai v'abitah niflaot mitoratecha!:prayer:

[Shimshon]

I have posted a theory regarding the chronology of Holy Week that I believe solves every problem I am currently aware of. If you could please use your expertise and perspective to test the hypothesis I would appreciate it.


Give me time to read the site ICHTHYS. I'm looking foward to hearing your theory. But alittle bit busy before todays shabbat.

b'shalom
Shimshon