Can anyone explain how the moth got it's owl eyes?

Warden_of_the_Storm

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Ok so I have you on record saying if we needed them, we would get them.
Very interesting, tell me what would cause the correct mutations to enable this.

... the environmental pressures that would force humans to adapt and evolve wings would cause the correct mutations to be selected.
Notice that phrase I keep using: environmental pressures.
 
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BCP1928

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There you have it
“the necessary mutations “
Every mammal seems to have gotten them!

LOL LOL LOL LOL
Hardly. Most mammalian species which have existed on the Earth are now extinct.
 
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AV1611VET

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If humans needed them because of environmental pressures, then we would evolve wings.

Since we don't, we won't.

Right.

1714683946712.jpeg
 
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BCP1928

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Ok so I have you on record saying if we needed them, we would get them.
Very interesting, tell me what would cause the correct mutations to enable this.
Random chance.
 
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AV1611VET

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Hence why, since we don't face the environmental pressures that would see humans needing to evolve wings, we won't evolve them.

Meaning untold billions of people would have to be driven into the sea by animals, weather, volcanoes and the like and drowned, over a period of millions of years, before we started sprouting wings?
 
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Thurston-howell-III

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... the environmental pressures that would force humans to adapt and evolve wings would cause the correct mutations to be selected.
Notice that phrase I keep using: environmental pressures.
They would?
Mutations are random, remember? Lol
 
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BCP1928

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Meaning untold billions of people would have to be driven into the sea by animals, weather, volcanoes and the like and drowned, over a period of millions of years, before we started sprouting wings?
We would never "sprout" wings. Wings would be developed gradually over a long time by slow modification of existing limbs. no doubt they would be for a long period adaptive to other activities besides flying. There is no guarantee that they would ever develop the capacity to sustain flight. Environmental conditions--and the resulting selection criteria--are subject to constant change. The need for flying humans might elapse.
 
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Thurston-howell-III

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Well, the mutations that happened are the ones which happened. Lucky for the species they happened to, I guess. But if different mutations had happened they might have been lucky for the species in some other way, or lucky for another species in the competition for survival. There is nothing necessary about any particular outcome. If you wound back the clock to the beginning of life and let it evolve all over again, you would get an entirely different collection of creatures making up the biosphere. Or, you might get a dead planet--after all, most of the species which have lived on Earth are now extinct.
 
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Tropical Wilds

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I was pretty sure he was using the term as I expected, I just wanted him to say he was using a slang term to slag on me. I would have also rejected his description of me as an "evolutionist". I am not. I am a physicist. I do not study biology.
As the thread goes on, it just becomes apparent to me that he doesn’t really understand what evolution is. I have visions that he thinks it’s something like X-Men.
 
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BCP1928

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They would?
Mutations are random, remember? Lol
And some of those random mutations are the right ones for the particular outcome you propose. Of course, evolution proposes no particular outcome, so those mutations are only the "right" ones in retrospect.
 
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AV1611VET

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We would never "sprout" wings. Wings would be developed gradually over a long time by slow modification of existing limbs. no doubt they would be for a long period adaptive to other activities besides flying. There is no guarantee that they would ever develop the capacity to sustain flight. Environmental conditions--and the resulting selection criteria--are subject to constant change. The need for flying humans might elapse.

I'll bet that's what this guy thought too:

1714685662300.jpeg
 
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Thurston-howell-III

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“Well, the mutations that happened are the ones which happened. Lucky for the species they happened to, I guess. “

Lucky indeed, do you know how many necessary lucky sequential mutations In just the correct order it took to create an eye and integrate it with a brain, muscles etc? Or, ah it’s nuthin
 
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AV1611VET

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As the thread goes on, it just becomes apparent to me that he doesn’t really understand what evolution is. I have visions that he thinks it’s something like X-Men.

Not me.

I found the missing links:

THREAD
 
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BCP1928

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“Well, the mutations that happened are the ones which happened. Lucky for the species they happened to, I guess. “

Lucky indeed, do you know how many necessary lucky sequential mutations In just the correct order it took to create an eye and integrate it with a brain, muscles etc? Or, ah it’s nuthin
Only if the eye was expected to evolve to its present state along the shortest evolutionary pathway, and if its essential configuration was not evolved when eyes generally were of much simpler construction.
 
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Ophiolite

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There you have it
“the necessary mutations “
Every mammal seems to have gotten them!

LOL LOL LOL LOL
Could I ask you, please, could we conduct these exchanges in a polite and respectful manner. Peppering your posts with snide and disrespectful language and attitude is disruptive. It suggests you have no interest in exchanging ideas, but mainly wish to offer ridicule and provocation. Please.
 
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